Original air Date Tuesday, 5 June 2001 This transcription is taken form the YouTube video at: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxCnp6KYWjo It does not include the phone calls and is only 1 hour 28 minutes Original show at Link to Coast to Coast AM Archives: https://www.coasttocoastam.com/show/i-shot-bigfoot/ Texas Guys shoot and kill Bigfoot and bury the Bodies Art Bell interview, Robert W. Morgan and Buggs: Transcribed by whorton 23-24 June 2021 1 A Few notes about the Transcription: First of all, Copyright Art Bell and Coast to Coast AM © 2005 Transcription by whorton, free of charge, not to be sold, but may be freely distributed. A few words about the transcription, First of all, this was an elaborate and time consuming job, it may be freely distributed, and is offered for educational purposes. This is of a dynamic conversation that was featured on Art Bell’s famous, or infamous Coast to Coast AM show. AS such, the conversation is complex, but every effort to make sure to capture every nuance of the parties involved was used. One of the individuals, Buggs: was an anonymous call in guest, His speech was very much in the popular country vernacular. AT times, the speech may seem peculiar, however, It was the speech the character offered. The seminal question involved was if Buggs: really shot and killed two Sasquatches in the Texas panhandle in 1976, with two friends, identified as BIRDDOG and JIM. . they too are anonymous. There has been considerable speculation, as Buggs: never called in again, nor was he heard from again. There is a credible rumor around that Buggs: was actually, Radio personality Ed Hale. I can neither confirm or Deny this. Every nuance of his speech was captured in so much as possible. A second person, is Robert W. Morgan. A reputed Bigfoot expert, I will leave a consideration of his commentary and his veracity to you, the reader. Art Bell, is of course the moderator, he needs no introduction. Time signatures on the notations, may be off a second or two either way. Every effort was made to ensure that the conversations were accurately captured and transcript. Some of the time stamps bear the same time, this was because some of the guests, and particularly, Art Bell, had a habit of interrupting. That is what is happening with these same time stamps. Ellipses ( . . .) indicate a short pause. Sometimes the speaker was about to posit another thought, other times, It was a pause before another speaker took up the conversation. “Ahm, Ah”, and other such words, are frequently used by all parties. They are transcribed as best as possible. I realize they are annoying. You should try transcribing them! Some comments were unintelligible and are noted as such. Comments in parenthesis (COMMENT) Indicate non conversational nuances. Laugher, Words which cannot be made out, etc. And there were comments that I could neither make heads or tails of. This transcription runs some 41 pages. As always, any mistakes are my responsibility. Enjoy this, but don’t count on finding the Sasquatchian bodies. I honestly suspect the story is a total fabrication. It seems Poor Mr. Morgan, was the recipient of a poorly conceived stage play. His comments seem most sincere. 2 00:00 (Ominous Opening music) 00:13 Art Bell: First of all, Ah, we’ve got ah, I’ve got a map to the burial location of two creatures. We’ll decide as the program wears on, what it is these creatures are. We’re gonna introduce two people to you right now, one is Robert W. Morgan. 0:33 Art Bell: Ah Robert are you there? 0:34 Robert: listening with both ears. 0:36: Art Bell, Ah you are there, OK, ahm, let’s see, the first thing you wanted me to was to give our your phone number on the air, Right? 0:43 Robert: LAUGHS Yeah, just like I am going to give out your Home. . . 0:45 Art Bell: Laughs 0:48: Robert: Ah-Ha-Ha, You Betcha! 0:51: Art Bell: Ah, alright, and so your being kinda being in retreat right now, when you first Ah, you wrote to me you said, I’m kinda undercover with a pal, so, you’ve, you.ve been, nobody has found you in a while Robert 01:00 Robert: Yes, I’m ah, ah living somewhere in Montana, and as you know, it is a pretty large state 01:06 Art Bell: I know 01:08 Robert: And I am here on purpose, and ahhhm, its ah, carrying on some things and had some significant ah, successes with those ahs audio cassettes that I had mentioned to you at one time. 01:18 Art Bell Right 01:21 Robert: And ah, so far, sixteen people so far, by following that have had face to face, ah. .. 01:28 Art Bell, MEETINGS? 01:30 Robert: Yeah 01:30 Art Bell: Encounters? 01:31: Robert: Yes 01:32 Art Bell: WITH BIGFOOT? 01:34 Robert . . . .and so, what I am trying here is since I found that ah, I needed an area where I wasn’t known and where people would ah not waste their time playing non-sense, and Ahm, starting from scratch, and at the same time, of course, I love Montana, I’ve been in and out of Montana for twenty some years and it’s absolutely fabulous. 01:55 Art Bell: Alright, ah, so your quest continues, and you’ve been researching Bigfoot for how long, Robert? 3 2:00 Robert: Well, ah, my first sighting was 1957, but I didn’t start serious Ahh, Ahm research until about, I think it was 1969. 2:12 Art Bell: And you have ah, did you write a book? 2:15 Robert: No, I ah did an audio cassette of, the book is incomplete, because I haven’t finished it yet, ahh, for obvious reasons. 2:21 Art Bell: Well, alright, well, I may have another chapter for you here. 2:25 Robert: GOOD! I’m, I’m all ready 2:26 Art Bell, Alright, so You’ll be doing a lot of listening although you are welcome to ask a question as the ah, story unfolds. 02:33 Robert: Thank you 02:34 Art Bell Ah, It was, Ah, I don’t know how long ago. . . .BUGGS? You there? 02:36 Buggs: Yes, I am Art, Good morning. 02:38 Art Bell: Good Mornings Buggs DOGS BARKING IN BACKGROUND 02:38 Art Bell: Ahm, Can you ah, 02:40 Buggs: . . .(unintelligible) 02:43: Buggs: Ahy, there is my douggs. . . 02:45 Art Bell, That your dog huh? 02:49 Art Bell, Buggs, you want to tell us what state are you in? 02:49 Buggs: Yeah, I’m in Texas, Art 02:50 Art Bell: Texas, Alright, Anm how long ago Buggs did you, can you tell me the story of originally what you did? 02:58 Buggs: Gosh, Art, it’s been Three or Four years 0:300 Art Bell: Three of fours years yeah, I thought it had been quite a while PAUSE, Time flies 03:04 Buggs: Yeah, I’m getting older every day. 03:06 Art Bell: Aren’t we all? Alright Buggs, we’ve got a real expert here, you can hear, Robert W. Morgan 03:10 Buggs: Good morning’ Robert 03:12 Robert: Good morning, Sir, how are you? 03:14 Buggs: I’m doing fine sir. And you? 03:15 Robert: I’m alive and mean as cat dirt, I keep telling everyone I’m all right, so I guess we are alright. 4 03:22: LAUGHTER. . . 03:23 Art Bell, Alright fine, Ah, Buggs if you would, begin at the beginning ah, and By the way, Buggs, before we even start, Why did you send me this map? 03:35 Buggs: Because Art, my days are limited on this earth, and when I’m gone, my wife is going to call you and say, “go for it” 03:43 Art Bell: Really? 03:44 Buggs: And you can reveal to the world a map, I have not been back to that place since that day. 03:49 Art Bell, alright let’s start then with that day. Go ahead and tell it in as much detail as you want, Buggs, 03:56 Buggs: Art, Me and two of my friends, ah, which I will refer to as BIRDDOG and JIM were coat bobcat hunters, back In the ah, the middle 70’s, those varmints was worth a lot of money Ah. . . 04:10 Art Bell INTERJECTING: How, how much could you get for one? 04:13 Buggs: Well, an old bobcat would bring anywhere from three to seven hundred dollars. That pelt. 04:17 Art Bell, Yeah, that’s not bad 04:20 Buggs: And Cayotes, would bring like forty or fifty dollars apiece. And we would go out, to be honest with you, We, it was a little more than a hobby, we were real serious about it. . . 04:29 Art Bell: Right 04:30 Buggs: and we hunted, many, many nights all over this country 04:35 Art Bell: Were you making your living that way then? 04:37 Buggs: Ahy yes, I was farming at that time, I’d, I had gotten out of the marines and ah, came back home and, I was farming and then, that part of the year, that was cotton country up there, so we ah, didn’t have much to do in Ah January and February except to kinda set around. . . 04:57 Art Bell: Mumm kay 04:59 Buggs: And ah, We hunted a lot in that period of time because you had to wait until the ah, freeze come for those pelts to cure or some reason, I don’t know, someone might explain it to me, But an animal more like a coon or a cayote or whatever, if you kill ‘em before it comes a hard freeze, when you skin ‘em their pelts are blue on the inside after they dry out, if you kill ‘em after a hard freeze, there white. . . 05:25 Art Bell: Huh? 05:28 Buggs: I have no earthly idea why that is. . . 05:29 Art Bell Does that sound right to you Robert? 05:32 Robert, Ah, yeah, eh, ah, I have seen that multi coloring, but I had no idea the reason, I didn’t make that correlation, that’s interesting. . . 5 05:58 Art Bell: Ok. . . 05:40 Buggs: Ah, so anyway it was like in December, January, February, that we hunted to minnus mount, then in late February, it gets into what they call the ruttin’ season and they (sic) animals would get mange and whatever and they wasn’t worth huntin’ So about two months you had prime time hunting, and me and these two guys we hunted a lot, we were all three from Viet Nam veterans and ah, very close, very close friends, and ah, we had ah, one night we had gone. . .I, I don’t know how to tell this to keep from giving the location away but ah. . . 06:21 Art Bell Whatever words you want, it doesn’t matter. . . 06:23 Buggs: If someone knows what I am talking about, they can find out but anyway, We had hunted and we ah, back in the flatlands so then ah we took this road back up ah North of where I am at now, and it swong around and it ah, ran through ranch country, it’s probably 25 or 30 miles, government ranch land. . . 06:45 Art Bell, So in other words this location is within what a hundred miles of where you are now? 06:50 Buggs: Oh, its closer than that. . . 06:52 Art Bell, Closer than that, alright 06:54 Buggs: Its ah, ah withing 30 miles of where I am at right now. 06:58 Art Bell: OK 06:59 Buggs: Anyway, we, we came around and we crossed this ah, we were going to cross this ah creek it’s ah more than a creek, it’s ah, but it’s name is Elm Creek, and we were going to cross that, that creek, we come around back North and coming down that county road to this ranch land and that stuff, and these ranchers would let us, cause we would get rid of the cayotes that were taking their calves and this had to be for, probably four or five in the morin, I don’t remember the exact time, come around the bend in this bottom there, just before you cross Elm Creek. . . 07:37 Art Bell: So, you’re huntin’ with lights then? 07:39 Buggs: Oh Yeah, we’re using spotlights off the top, the roof of the pickup using ah, 500 watt ah, halogen bulbs, it would light up anything from, within half a mile ah, you, you can see where you’re stand ‘in See your ground good. . . 07:55 Art Bell: And, ah, ah anything with eyes lights up real well? 07:58 Buggs: Oh, them ol’ eyes. . .the thing about it is after you hunted as much as we did you could tell by look’in at a set of eyes what they were. . . 08:05 Art Bell: Mumhumm 08:07 Buggs: if they were a cow, they were wide apart and they were RED, If they were a cayote, ah, there were ah, narrow, and they were more blue-red. I mean it just after a period of time, Art, you just You just you, knew what look’in at scope and you knew what was there. . . 08:23 Art Bell I’m not a hunter so I just take your word for it. . . NERVOUS LAUGH. . . 6 08:24 Buggs: Well, It was, it was, it was just outta way. But anyway, we come around this bend and it come up over this rise and it was a wheat field out in front of us, An-na, and, just before for we crossed this creek it was this valley down there and I’d say it’s ah probably, its ah, I’d say its ah as wheat land right there, its probably a quarter mile or so wide, cause it, from that road it, through the creek and it just probably a mile, about a mile long that runs along side that creek its flat and this and that and we come around this bend and up and over a little hill dropped into this valley. . . Well just as we dropped into this valley our, our lights hit, picked up a set of eyes and ah, I hit the brakes, I was driving and BIRDDOG, he come out on the side, and he had a .300 Weatherby magnum and he come across the top and I said, “What you got” and he says “I don’t know, it ain’t something I ever seen before well, it just sat there and so I. . . 09:28 Art Bell: INTERRUPTING, when you said a set of eyes, did you mean two eyes or four? 09:33 Buggs: Two eyes, two eyes. 09:35 Robert: What color were they Buggs, if you don’t mind. . . 09:36 Buggs: They were 09:38 UNKNOWN SIGHS 09:38 Buggs: FURIOUS RED. . .The reddest eyes I have ever seen in my life. 09:42 Robert Really? 09:44 Buggs: under those lights, ah, they it was something we, It knew it wasn’t a deer because, ah, the eyes It was something 09:54 to time index 0957 LOSS OF AUDIO SIGNAL 09:58 Buggs: My scope on it and I could see what Whatever it was, was crouching And ah, So, BIRDDOG he got out and leaned over the hood of the pickup where he could get him a good shot, and JIM, he come over the top of the cab he, he, I don’t even remember the rifle, what kind of a rifle he was using, I think he was using a .270, I don’t remember for sure but lined up over the cab and I was sitting there and we just both had, we both had spot lights on this varmint there and ah, I said, ah, I don’t know what it is and they don’t either but it sure ain’t nothing we know about, Let’s take it. And all three of us fired at the same time, and all the sudden this thing got up,(LAUGHS), And it must’a been seven, eight foot tall at least, I don’t know SCARED THE HECK OUTTA us, and started runnin’ and well, we all loaded and we fired again, we knocked it down again and then it run, ah, I guess ah, ah it was probably a hundred and maybe a hundred and fifty yards from the point where we first the first time, till it hit that fence and went into that creek and ah we knocked it down, it was probably twenty five, thirty yards from the ah fence. . . 11:13 Art Bell (INTERRUPTS) It fell into a creek. 11:14 Buggs: No, not at this point, and just as it was crossing the creek, we hit it again. 11:19 Robert: Now was it, Excuse me, was it running on four legs or two? 11:21 Buggs: It was running on two legs, just like a human being, And I mean, it just . . 7 11:26 Robert: Right so it was running on two legs . . . 11:29 Buggs: Right 11:30 Robert: something you’ve never seen before, but you three guys cut down on it 11:33 Buggs: Well, we had done shot and we did not know what it was, it was hunched over, it was. . . 11:39 Robert: DEEP SIGH 11:40 Buggs: It was hunched over, it really wasn’t using its front legs, I mean its arms, as much as it was ah. . . it wasn’t standing up straight, we still thought what it was, what we thought it was at first to be honest with you, was a bear. 11:56 Robert: Yeah. . . 11:56 Buggs: And that’s why we fired. 11:59 Art Bell: So, so you had three of you fired initially. 12:00 Buggs: Right, 12:01 Art Bell Right, so 12:03 Buggs: We fired three times. 12:04 Art Bell: so, you. . 12:05 Robert, You guys are all Nam vets, right? 12:06 Buggs: Right 12:06 Robert And, so, you’ve had. . . Night Combat, I’m sure 12:07 Buggs: Right 12:11 Robert: Ok,so, you’ve had something getting up on two legs and running away and you still cut down on it, Ok, alright, but, ah, I have the picture, go ahead, please 12:20 Buggs: Ok, well, like I said, I originally thought it was a bear. 12:23 Robert: Mum humm 12:24 Buggs: I did not, I had no idea, but we had done fired on it, at the point in time that it was setting out there. . (PAUSE). . . and ah, once, once we fired. . .(PAUSE). . . I don’t know, I guess we just, got a little bit Gung ho! And kept shooting. . . but anyway, the second time we shot it, it went over the fence. . . . . Well, we went and looked and we, at this point in time we was all gett’in scared because we thought well, this wasn’t an animal. 12:58 Robert Alright 12:58 Buggs: So, Like I say, it was probably three, four, five in the morning so we decided to drive around a while about five thirty, six, we went back over there we drove back over there and we went 8 down it and we saw blood, so we seen some tracks, ah, looked like a human foot and ah to be honest with you, I thought we went out and shot a human. . . 13:24 Robert: Um Humm. . . . 13:24 Buggs: So, I’m getting’ scared, so we go on up and start following these tracks and the creek runs oh, from this point, probably, fifty, seventy five yards east and then it turns back some, (COUGHS), These tracks go down the creek and they come out and ah, . . .straight on East, ah from where the creek turned back South . . .About another oh twenty five, thirty yards, there was a ah, Plumb thicket and we were walking there and we heard something in that Plumb thicket, I mean it was ah, Growl type ah sound, we kinda looked at each other and decided who goes in to see what it was. . . 14:13 Art Bell: A growl 14:14 Buggs: And again, at this point we though it’s a bear, we done found a bear up here, so ah, I got elected, I had a .44 magnum pistol, I climbed into the Plumb thicket, and I got in, probably, Twenty feet at the most, and Art. Huh, This thing come up at me I mean, It couldn’t have been over, I would say six or seven feet from me, I didn’t even see it until it was there, and it raised up and let out a sound that ’ed just, it was very similar to the one you have on your tape and when it did. . . 14:57 Art Bell: You’re talking about ah, as he grabs for this one, I presume. . . (LOUD UNSETTLING ROAR WITH ECHO) that repeats and persists until 15:15) Anything like that? 15:15 Buggs: Yeah, its just like the first one, not a repeat, just ah. . . 15:19 Art Bell (INTERRUPTS) Yeah, that first scream is ah said to be an ah authentic Bigfoot sound, Robert? 15:26: Robert: (STOICALLY) Yeah, that is what they say, I, I have never heard them scream like that, I’ve heard them ah howl, I’ve heard them hoot and I have heard them talk, but I’ve never heard. . . 15:35 Art Bell: You’ve never heard them scream like that? 15:36 Robert, No. . . 15:38 Robert: Well, first of all, I’ve never ah challenged them, they don’t ah perceive me as a threat of any sort, so they wouldn’t try to . . . 15:45 Art Bell: Understood, so anyway Buggs:, it sounded something like that? 15:50 Buggs: Something similar to that first part, it didn’t go on and on, it was just one shriek like that, and I’m basically on all fours in a crawl position and I just brought my forty four up, and I started poppin shells and the first one, I, I hit it ah, the first one hit it, I was aiming right at the chest, I. . . 16:10 Art Bell: Describe, since you are seeing this full on, what did it look like? 16:15 Buggs: (DEEP SIGH) Ahmm. . 16:17 Art Bell: Best you can 16:19 Buggs: At that point 9 16:20 Art Bell: Six feet tall. . 16:21 Buggs: Probably, but it was not standing up, Art, at that point, it was more in a hunched, squat type position, 16:28: Art Bell: Alright 1629: Buggs: I mean, It come up. . . 16:30 Art Bell: Would you describe this as human looking, as, as Ape looking, did it have hair covering it, what can you tell us about it? 16:37: Buggs: It had Bredish roun(sic), red, Brownish, red hair ah. . .it had hair on the face, ah, completely covered in the face, ah, the, It’s, it’s whole body was, it was covered with hair, at that point, I just fired ah, it dropped down, started back up, I fired again and it, it then kinda rocked, went backwards and it come back up, and I fired again. I hit it three times with a two hun. . two hundred twenty five grain .44 magnum hollow point At probably Six to eight feet. . 17:23 Robert: Ummph 17:24 Buggs: And it was down, well, the other guys were standing guard, up on top watching and they couldn’t see nothing, they heard me firing, and they yelled, if I was alright, “Yeah, I got it” Well, They came, they came crawling in there, ‘n’ where I was at and they seen it, so we decided we’d drag it out We got to lookin’ and all this thing had was three holes, and, this was a female, you could tell, it had breasts similar to a, to ah woman, it had a sexual organ similar to a woman. . . .facial features were different, than a human being I don’t say it was completely covered in hair. We went back in and found a male, probably I’d say eight ten feet behind where she was at, he was dead. . . 18:17 Art Bell: “He was dead.” 18:17 Buggs: Yeah, so we drug him out, we laid him outside beside, I, the male was probably six to eight inches taller than the female estimating the male to be eight foot plus, the female, ah seven plus (COUGHS), so we looked at ‘em, we got scared, because, It was like I . . .and the male Sexual organs like a human Ah, we looked at their teeth, there were NOT HUMAN type teeth. I can’t say there were an ape, I can’t say there were a Human. They, they looked, they had the features of a human overall, but ah, the details were not. . . 19:10 (OMINOUS MUSIC PLAYS). . .Goes to break. . 19:17 Art Bell: Alright once again ah, ub, I want to cover this, I am getting a lot of judgmental stuff, Ah, saying stuff like “You killed it after you knew it was a bear” or “though it was a bear,” or or, “Did it ever occur to them that maybe he shouldn’t shoot it” or, “please, run the other way”, or “My God, out shooting animals,” ahh, ah, a lot of judgmental stuff but, if I were to be judgmental we wouldn’t get the story, what I really want is the truth here, so I’m not going to sit in judgment of ah, of Buggs there are a lot of people that are responding that way Buggs, (Brief audio disruption) But I am the truth, I want the truth and if that is what you are doing then that is what you are doing and so, I just want the truth so you are telling us the truth right? 20:01 Buggs: That is correct Art, I wouldn’t ah sent you a map otherwise. 10 20:06 Art Bell: No, I believe you, I believed you the first time, and I believe you now, ah, there are a lot of people who don’t like it, but this is a very important story in view of the probably physical evidence that still exists. Ah. . . 20:18 Buggs: You got to remember something, at that point in time, we were our living basically huntin’ There was many a night I went out and made a thousand dollars in a night. 20:31 Art Bell: Really? 20:32 Buggs: I mean, there was, there was one night, my biggest night ever we killed three bobcats, seven cayotes, eighteen coons and we had twenty four hundred dollars the next day. 20:45 Art Bell: I’ve got yah . . .So again, ah, I’m not judging you here, I’m, I, Ah, Somebody else would like to know, they’ve got to find your old listening And they really want to know what this, these creatures looked like, now you said not exactly human, not exactly total animal, like something in between, is there some way you can describe the facial features of ah, ah these creatures that should be imprinted on your memory. . . 21:12 Buggs: Yeah, Art, Huh, No, because I never seen nothing on this earth that looks like ‘em. I, I, I, they, their heads, they have a nose, similar to a human. 21:29 Ok 21:29 Buggs: Their mouths, ah, appear to be more ape, ah, their eyes are sunken back in their head more than human, I mean, I think if you take a human and cross it with a ape, you could probably come up with a reasonable facsimile of it. 21:55 Art Bell: Ok 21:55 Robert, you know what I might suggest Art, if you don’t mind. 21:57 Art Bell: sure 21:27 Robert: Ahm, ahm, Buggs: after we go off the air, if you would give Art your mailing address, which I. . . 22:05 Buggs: Which I 22:06 Art Bell: I have it 22:07 Buggs: . . .He has everything, my mailing address, my phone numbers, he has everything. 22:09 Robert: Ok what I would like to do is. . . 22:10 Art Bell: Robert, Robert, I let me just interrupt, I promise him anonymity and, and will explain why her ah, shortly. 22:18 Robert: Oh No, No, No, what I mean is I do is send a copy to you Art, and have you forward it to, ah Buggs, the idea is this, on the cover of that is one of the best artist’s rendering of that I’ve ever seen, because, I sat with the artist myself . . . 22:36 Art Bell: On the cover of what? 11 22:29 Robert: on the cover of ah (LOTS OF NOISE, voice dips) . . .Stuff that I have 22:40 Art Bell, oh a gazette, oh of the cover of your cassette, Ok 22:43 Robert: And that way, and what I would like to do is get a reaction from Buggs when and he can tell that to you. That is number one, Number two, can I ask you something Buggs ah, what kind of soil, were these two buried in? 22:58 Robert, Ah, was it sandy, was it ah, di. . . 23:02 Buggs: In this part of the country, it is Sandy Loam, and it was ah, it wasn’t ah silt-sand but it was sandy loam in that particular place where we buried ‘em, it was more of a, Ah gravel type ah, of sand, because it was the ah, it did have some rock in it, because it that creek was probably at the point where we buried it there in the creek, kinda went South oh about probably about a hundred and fifty, probably two hundred, fifty yards and then it turned back east and over a period of time when we had a lot of high rains in this part of the country, it would wash silt and such in there 23:40 Art Bell: How fa. . . 23:42 Robert, are you saying that the ah, the creek would overflow into this specific area? 23:47 Buggs: Yes, 23:48 Robert: Oh boy, cause that’ll cause a different type of decomposition, did you take a GPS reading? 23:56 Buggs: Ah what? 23:57 Art Bell: Probably not, Robert, I would say, probably not, a GPS. 24:01 Buggs: Ah, huh eh, No, I don’t have one of them animals. . 24:03 Art Bell: Laughs Ah Yeah. .. 24:05 Robert: Ok, if we supplied one, would you get, take the readings and send those to ah, ah, Art 24:09 Art Bell: Ah, well, he has given me an extremely specific map. Very, very, specific 24:14 Buggs: I mean that map is detailed down. . to 24:15 Art Bell: Yeah 24:16 Buggs: the ah foot, I 24:19 Art Bell: You would know where to dig . . .Ah listen. . . 24:19 Buggs: To be honest with you, this happened very, close to thirty years ago and I have not been out there since. 24:26 Art Bell: Buggs: ahm, when you have these things laying on the ground what did you guys talk about and why did you decide to bury them? 24:33 Buggs: We thought they could be human, Art. . . (LAUGHS) and we didn’t want to go to jail. 12 24:44 Art Bell: Ahm, but what you just described i, it is. . .yeah, I understand, in other words were sitting there 24:44 “Buggs: (OVER ART BELL) You’re sitting there, and you are looking at the sexual organs of two animals that’s got are identical to human beings, what do you think? 24:59 Art Bell: Ahm Robert, you ah, wh- with what you know about Bigfoot, ahm, do they have sexual organs? Ah, ah er-A the report you get, do they have sexual organs similar to humans? 25:10 Robert: Oh yes, so far, everything that Buggs: has mentioned is ah, ah something that I have observed myself, so ah yes 25:20 Art Bell: Oh. . . 25:20 Robert: he’s right on the nose, er-a 25:23 Buggs: Thank you Robert, I appreciate that fact. 25:25 Art Bell: Have you ever seen ah, Buggs, any of the Bigfoot photos, like the Patterson film, any of those? 25:32 Buggs: Oh no (TALKING OVER ART) no, I haven’t. . .opt, no. . 25:35 Art Bell: would somebody please send me a good ah, Bigfoot photograph, right away 25:40 Buggs: I’m on the computer, I can, can ah look at it 25:45 Robert: Well, it’s too bad our web site isn’t up, we have all of them on there. . 25:47 Art Bell: Oh, you do? 25:48 Robert: Yes, and unfortunately, it’s under reconstruction right at the moment. 25:50 Art Bell: Well, somebody will send us a photograph, depend on it. In the next ah 15 minutes or so, we’ll try and get it up for the next hour. 26:00 Buggs: I, I will give a little more detail if(sic) the location of this tends to tease the people out there, ah the 26:07 Art Bell: ah. . 26:09 Ah the Biggest River in the State of Texas that ah I guess you might say is the Red River. This Elm Creek is a branch off of the Red River, of the state of Texas. 26:25 Art bell: K. . Ahmm. . .That is the only sound, actually, you only heard, heard that scream that sound, but other than that, you heard a growling as you would describe it. . . 26:37 Buggs: I don’t know whether it was a growling or a rustling, but something got our attention in those bushes. 26:46 Art Bell: Now when they move, you said they moved on two feet, ah or seemed to walk on two feet hunched over, or straight up? 13 26:51 Buggs: It was hunched over, eh, it, to be honest with you, it looked like a bear, when it was running away from us, it looked like a bear, I’m think’in dollar signs, that is why I fired. 27:05 Robert: It was probably pretty badly injured, ah, by your first ah fusillade, and ah, what he was doing, I think is Number one, escaping, Number two, he was going to the protection of the ah, hopefully of his ah, mate, and ah, the mate may have picked him up and carried him to where you caught him. 27:26 Art Bell: FINE! 27:26 Buggs: I don’t know that that happed cause there was ah, grass, ah, ah where he came out of that creek and ah, headed ah East there. 27:37 Robert: (MEEKLY) Um-hum. . . 27:38 Art Bell: Maurice in Modesto California asks ah, if you’re hunting for money, why didn’t you decide to bring these, creatures back, for a hell of a profit, they would be worth a fortune 27:48 Unknown subtle laughter 27:50 Buggs: Yeah, and maybe go to jail for it or your live too. 27:51 Art Bell: Yeah. . . 27:52 Robert: Yeah, I think the fellow in Modesto was overlooking the fact that if these are humanoid then ah, under the American Constitution, they have civil rights and ah, Buggs is indeed correct, he could be charged with manslaughter at least. . . 28:06 Art Bell: You know what, by the time you, we did the original show, by the time we finished the original show, Buggs was actually going to invite me out there. . . 28:12 Robert: Um-HUM. . . 28:15 Art Bell: . . and we were going to dig these bodies up, 28:17 Robert: Good 28:17Art Bell: Cause this was years ago. . . 28:17 Buggs: I said I’d show you, Art, But, I ain’t digging ‘em up. Hey, let me tell you something, I own a farm near this place. . . 28:25 Art Bell: Yes sir 28:26 Buggs: And I won’t go out there at night because about, oh, Year or so ago, I was out there late one evening with my dogs, they loved to go out and swim in the creek, and I heard that sound, and Art, I know they still aren’t still out there, and to be honest with ya, I think they are looking for me. 28:43 Robert: Well, I’ll tell you what Buggs, we could do something, what oh, ah, this is something, this is just a proposition here, if you would ahm, ah, show Art where it is and ah, Ya know if, I could be somehow involved, I would take the heat for you, and I think I could get you off the hook if. . . 29:01 Art Bell: I’m not sure you could take the heat, In fact, Larry in Anchorage asks, “is it even feasible to believe these bodies are still there?” 14 29:11 UNKNOWN COUGH 29:11 Robert: It’s pretty rough in that kind of ah- Ahm kind of ah, sandy, sandy loam, because if you have a lot of water running through there, it is going to decompose rather rapidly and ah, this would also ah, the escaping gases would call in Cayotes and ah those ske. . . 29:30 Buggs: Well, now, we buried ‘em probably, they had to be at least four or five foot deep, Robert. 29:35 Robert: Oh Really? 29:36 Buggs: and hey, let me tell you something, like I train, we were all Viet Nam Vets, we all know how to cover our tracks. 29:43 Robert: (LAUGHTER) 29:43 Buggs: We walked away from there (ABRUPT SHORT LOSS OF SIGNAL) 29:45 Robert: . . .Cause the idea is since the ah, I, A, Art, you know my feeling about hunting and using guns on Bigfoot, However, ah if the deed is done, there is nothing we can do, but we wouldn’t want them to die in vain, and if they can prove ah, Buggs, listen to me please, If we can prove they exist, by virtue of two skeletons, then in effect you are protecting the rest of them, because I am very confident they are going to come out as humanoid, ah, so an act on your part at this time would indeed help protect The rest of them. 30:30 Art Bell: Buggs, what about the, your two friends, what has their attitude been since? 30:35 Buggs: You know, something, we haven’t talked in probably, I guess, ten or fifteen years, Ah, they both moved away from here, I think they both had the same kinda feeling that I did, it was time ta pack up and go. . 30:48 Art Bell: That you might’a killed something, that was human or something 30:52 Buggs, I mean, it wasn’t something that it bothered us that we had killed humans, cause we had done that before, You know, I mean to take out a person, that was no big deal to us. . 31:03 Robert: But that was in War, and they were 31:04 Buggs: That’s right 31:04 Robert: and they were armed. . . 31:05 Buggs, that is right, That is right 31:05 Robert: a totally different thing. . . 31:05 Buggs: Totally different situation what we were in there today, at that time 31:13 Robert: Yeah, you were doing your duty, Pal. 31:16 Buggs: And I understand that, You know, when we got into this situation, I would not have shot the female onced (SIC) I got, saw her, except I feared for my life 31:26 Robert: Oh you had the right to theirs, if it would have attacked you 15 31:30 Art Bell: Buggs, what about Smell, did you smell anything, do these creatures smell? 31:34 Buggs: Art, I can’t remember, I really can’t remember that Ah, I 31:44 Art Bell: Well, if it had been really distinct, I’m sure you would have. 31:47 Buggs: Yeah, it was probably ah, it I, I try to back a lot of this out of my memory and it’s tough trying to draw it back up. Because I knew what I had done, I realized what we had done, and I realized there might be consequences and the only reason I was able to send you this map, cause for three years, I have never had one phone call, You knew how I was, you knew where I was, You knew my phone number and everything, yet No body ever got it, So I trust you. . . 32:23 Art Bell: and you can trust me, although I am not sure I’m happy I have the map. If you dug the hole four to five foot deep, shot them at four in the morning, drove around, shot more, they would have been digging and burying in the day light, correct? 32:36 Buggs: Right This was ah, it, the sun came up around six O’clock, six thirty It was day, but the sun wasn’t up daylight enough for us to see, and the, when we found them, we are probably talking about the sun was just ready to peak over the top of the hill, ah, we’re talking probably six thirty, six forty five, maybe seven O’clock, and after we found ‘em and drug ‘em out and everything, we’re probably talking eight O’clock, and it don’t take very long to dig when you are scared, and probably withing an hour we had dug a hole and put ‘em back, and we’d left. 33:17 Art Bell, Did you bury them in one hole or separate holes? 33:20 Buggs: One 33:21: Buggs: One hole 33:22 Buggs, On top of each other 33:25 Art Bell: Yeah, that would make sense, Ahm, after this was over and they were buried, did the three of you talk 33:32 Buggs: Yep 33:33 Art Bell: and what did you talk about? 33:34 Buggs, and we swore to ourselves secrecy, Art 33:39 Art Bell: You swore each other to secrecy? 33:42: Buggs: yeaht. . 33:44: Art Bell, Ahm, and 33:44 Buggs: Never to reveal it to anybody 33:46 Art Bell: Except for ah, years later, many years later, you went on the radio with me and you told this story 33:52 Art Bell: And now, you’re telling it again 16 33:52 Buggs: Well, when you get to be old, and you start to thinking (sic) about some things you did in your life that I need to make some corrections about 34:00 Art Bell: That you weren’t that happy about 34:03 Buggs, Naught, That I did in my life that I’m still scarred about today Art. . 34:11 Art Bell: You feel guilty about it? 34:11 Buggs, Oh, yeah, tremendous amount of guilt, because, I don’t know, I might ‘a taken an innocent human being’s life, ah 34:19 Art Bell, you know, maybe, maybe for a hunter, it not the same way Buggs, but when you look into a human’s eye you can see ah, an intelligence, I mean you know your dealing with an intelligent creature. I don’t know if you had enough eye contact before or ahm, or, it happened all too fast, in all probability but I wonder if you had a chance to look into their eyes, and whether you discerned anything from that you were dealing with an intelligence or something that was about to kill you. 34:51 Buggs: No Art, I couldn’t tell you to be honest with you, it was just a quick knee jerk reaction, and it was ah, ah fire, because I knew that I was in danger, and I knew she was fixing to come after me. I knew it was a matter of a millisecond, I either had to fire, or I was gone, and I didn’t hesitate. 35:13 Art Bell, Yeah, obviously ahm, with the other one dead, I would think that that creature would, have killed you pretty quick, if it could have. 35:24 Buggs, Oh Art, it could have 35:24: Robert: Yes, it would have. . . 35:25 Buggs: Believe you me, it could have, as big as this thing was, Art, I’m Six foot one. . . 35:28 Art Bell: There’s a lot of People, Buggs, there is a lot of people that think bigfoot could have, is some sort of paranormal creature, but it sounds to me like the creatures were real dead, ah, you know, like mammals, animals, and humans, who get shot are dead, ah, nothing paranormal about that. 35:40 Buggs, Yeah 35:40 Art Bell (TALKING OVER BUGGS) They never disappeared on you 35:50 Buggs: no. .nope, 35:51 Art Bell (CONTINUES TALKING OVER BUGGS) Nothing ever strained about tha. . . 35:54 Art Bell: What about. . .Blood? 35:55: Buggs: Red blood, just like ours 35:58 Art Bell: A lot of it? 36:00 Buggs: Ah, quite a bit, Quite a bit . . . especially hers, I mean his, he had a big pool where he was hit. And near the heart area, I would assume . . .Ah, I would imagine his, he had a pool of blood, I am trying to remember now, but I would say it was probably was(sic) where he was laying, and he was probably a foot and a half circle in diameter. 17 36:34 Art Bell: And so, everybody swore everybody else to secrecy, ah forever . . 36:38 Buggs: Right 36:39 Art Bell: . . .on this matter. . 36:45 Art Bell: Ah, Robert, If it happened that long ago, I am assuming that the, thub, the remains have not been washed away. What might we expect to find if, anything? 36:56 Robert: Ah, ah, you could find probably ah quite a bit of the skeleton ah, you could ah, most importantly for us, it would be finding the teeth, because within the teeth, tha, ah, even after many years, you can find ah, viable DNA 37:15 Art Bell: DNA? 37:19 Robert: yes. 37:19: Art Bell: Alright, well I have heard, that they have found hair recently, and they do a DNA test on it, and it comes as hominoid of some sort, unidentifiable, so what do we get from that? I know, in other words, it you have a hair sample, an, and they say, “Yes, it was some sort of mammal or “hom-i-nod,” in some way but it was, it’s not identifiable, so that’s the end of the story.” 37:43 Robert: Right, we had that happen to us and we had that in 1974 and we had that also in 1972 A hair tells you, ah, quite a bit about the DNA, but it’s still will not convince(sic) science 38:00 OMINOUS MUSIC: OSTENSIBLE BREAK 38:12 Art Bell: All right, we are only going to have Buggs here for a little while longer, so on top of him seeing the photographs, I want to ask him a few more questions with Robert, before we lose him, I know you’ve got a, ah really hard day today didn’t you Buggs. . . 38:24 Buggs: Ah, yeah 38:26 Art Bell: LAUGHS 38:27 Buggs: I’ve got a couple of questions I need to ask Robert 38:28 Art Bell: ALL RIGHT! 38:30 Buggs: Robert, can these creatures know who I am, and what I did? 38:34 Robert: Yes 38:36 Buggs: The reason why I say that is because, Like I said, so, it’s been six months since last summer, I was at my farm late one evening and they, it just got dark and I ah, I have a creek that runs into this creek that I am talking about, and I heard, it was not a cayote, that howl. . 39:02 Robert: um Hum. . . 39:05 Buggs: And it just made the hair on the back of my neck stand up, and I, I just felt in my heart that this had to be one of these creatures. . . 39:11 Art Bell: Was it the same kind of Howl, or roughly the same? 18 39:14 Buggs: as what? 39:15 Art Bell: As what you heard originally? 39:17 Buggs: No, no, this was not similar to what you have on tape, this was . . . 39:21 Art Bell: No, No, No, Ah, To what you heard originally 39:22 Buggs: (Unintelligible) 39:22: Art Bell (Unintelligible) 39:27 Buggs, I don’t know, I can’t place. . . 39:29 Robert: How many Statute miles are you from the site. . . 39:36 Buggs: Well, that creek is approximately six miles 39:38 Robert: About six miles away? And, from where you are. . . 39:40 Buggs: Down stream 39:41 Robert: Down Stream? 39:42 Buggs: It flows, it flowed down into this place 39:45 Robert: Had you hunted that area before? 39:37 Buggs: Oh yeah. . . 39:49 Robert: Ok, So the identity, the identify, they could have identified you, and believe me six miles is a, ah, ahm a segment, a Sunday stroll for these people, so more than likely, they have identified you, yes, (MUFFLED) your probably right. . . 40:04 Buggs I ah. . 40:05 Robert (Unintelligible) 40:05 Buggs: I am very careful. 40:07 Buggs: Am I in any Danger? 40:09 Robert: Ah. . . It’s been how many years? 40:12 Buggs: This was 1976 40:14 Robert: Right, ’76, ah, It’s possible, but prob . . I Ah say that I am going to sound very weird here for a second, if, you would go out on the edge of that and hold your hands open and out to your side, ah, where they can see you have no weapons whatso ever, and now, this is going to sound strange to you, Talk to them. Just talk, and when every you have a feeling, they are out there, go out and, Just A, let yourself go, da, tell them what you think. 40:42 Unknown Huh. . . 19 40:43 Robert: and wha. . .you made a mistake you know its gonna, it doesn’t hurt anyone, It could help you, And God only knows, the might, might, understand. . . 40:52 Unknown (unintelligible) 40:54 Buggs: I don’t even own a weapon anymore, I’d, this, after this happened, I quit hunting, eh, like I say, I can’t even pull a trigger, now even to defend myself. . . 41:05 Art Bell: Ah Buggs, I have a question for you, Chris in Medford Oregon, asks, “I was wondering how heavy these creatures were,” and he thinks you can judge this because you all had to lift them to bury them, right? 41:17 Buggs: Right, I’m gonna say they probably weighed 350 pounds . . . 41:23 Art Bel: Oh My. . . 41:26 Buggs: They, they, it was al. . .we could do to move ‘em. 41:26 Art Bell: That’s a lot of body mass. 41:28 Buggs: oh, that, tell me about it, a body is the heaviest thing on Earth. 41:33 Art Bell: Somebody else says, ah, and maybe this isn’t true, or maybe it certainly is, Ah, the only thing missing is the grief that he hides, but he has nightmares of killing the female. 41:47 Buggs: Yeah . . . I did for a long time, Art, I did for a long time, Ah, I have woke up at nights, ah, again in that position firing my weapon. . .I mean, I went through some harry things in Viet Nam, I was First marine recon in Viet Nam. . . 42:10 Robert: Good lord. . . 42:11 Buggs: I did a lot of L.R.P.’s (Long Range Patrols) from one day to twelve days. Ah, I know what it’s all about, that don’t bother me, it’s This thing with her, that bothers worst of all of ‘em, cause, that is the closest I’ve ever come to death. 42:29 Art Bell: Yeah, I hear ‘ya. . . Ahm, you described the fact that Ah, the imprint of the feet, seemed like a human footprint. . . 42:42: Buggs: Yeah. 42:42 Art Bell: Was it bigger than a usual human footprint, but judging by the weight I would think It would be. . . 42:47 Buggs, Oh Yeah, I would say, Ohh. . .Isn’t it Michael Jordan that has to have size 18 shoes, or what size basketball player, I would say it was probably in that size. . .Acht, there is one thing that I never revealed to anybody about the foot of this animal. . . 43:05 Art Bell: what? 43:07 Buggs, and therefore I am very reluctant, a lot of these people talk about Bigfoot and stuff, but there is something about their feet that is different than anybody else, Robert should know what I am talking about. . . 20 43:19 Robert: yeah. . .I, I think I do. . . 43:20 Art Bell: Let’s not have Robert say, you say. . .What? 43:26 Buggs: Six toes. . . 43:27 Art Bell: What? 43:29 Buggs: Six toes 42:32 Robert: mumppft 43:33 Art Bell: SIX. . . . . . . Toes? On both of the creatures, both feet. . . 43:35 Buggs: both of the creatures . . . 43:39 Robert: that is an anomaly, I think . . . I am going to take a wild guess here; you must be within 100 miles of the Arkansas Border . . . 43:50 Buggs: Naought. . . 43:53 Robert: I say in that case, there was a family in Arkansas of Bigfoot that did have a six toed ah, ahm genetic code. . 44:03 Buggs: Ok. . . 44:03 Robert: And Ah, bu. . .they may have spread into ahh, eastern Texas, that is possible, but that is not the norm. . . . 44:09 Art Bell: All Right, eh, you, you, 44:10 Buggs: (INTERRUPTING) Each, . . . I am in the Texas panhandle and ah. . .It’s like I say, this creek. 44:21 Art Bell: (INTERRUPTING) DON’T SAY ANY MORE, Buggs, don’t say anymore. . . 44:20 Robert: Yeah. . I don’t. . . 44:23 Art Bell, TEXAS Panhandle is close enough 44:27 Buggs: AH. AND AH. . . everything, everything, you know Red River runs from Arkansas up to Texas. 44:33 Robert: Mm Hum. .. . 44:30 Buggs: It is the border of Texas Oklahoma, so I am assuming that these animals come from that direction, where they were going, I have no idea. 44:42 Art Bell: Buggs you said, in the light, the eyes were RED, whata, (sic) what about . . . 44:46 Buggs: Spotlights, Yes 44:48 Art Bell: What about, when they were dead? 44:55 Buggs: Ah, Black, I couldn’t see any pupils or anything like that, just black eyes. . .Little larger than human eyes 21 45:06 Art Bell: Ok 45:07 Robert, (Unintelligible), You know Buggs, I’m very, sorry, I am not a hunter myself, I used to hunt, years and years, but I, I came through the same transition that you did, I don’t want to see anything die anymore, I, I have no time for it. But at the same time, I must say, Honestly, I am so pleased that you contacted Art Bell . . . 45:26 Art Bell: Buggs I ah 45:27 Robert: if you would . . . 45:28 Art Bell: Buggs, you said you had a computer there? 45:29 Buggs: Yes, 45:30 Art Bell: Go right now out, is, is it . . . 45:34 Buggs: I’ve got your web site up 45:35: Art Bell: Oh, you do? Under what’s new you will see ah, the first item now, instead of clown board hexes. it says Bigfoot images, click on that. 45:42 Buggs: All I’ve got. . . I ne. . 45:44 Art Bell: Refresh, Refresh, and then go to what’s new, and you’ll see Bigfoot images . . . 45:49 Buggs: Ok. 45:50 Art Bell: See ‘em? 45:51 Buggs: There coming up. 45:52 Art Bell: Ok. . . there is four of them right now. . My listener is doing me a favor and getting these images up Ah, quickly some are drawings. 46:03 Buggs: I think everybody is at the web site the same time as me. 46:07 Art Bell: two of them are drawings, at least one is a photograph, two may be photographs and two are drawings. 46:14 Buggs: The first one coming up, the hair is the wrong color, 46:15 Art Bell: Ok but what about ah, the general, was it, was it more was it closer to a human than that? 46:24 Buggs: Oh Yeah, this looks like an ape here. 46:27 Art Bell: yeah. . . 46:28 Buggs: This, this is, no this first picture, Of course, Like I say, It’s loading up slow while I seen this they eye but the ah, eyes were sunken in, but, the ah, Above the eyes I guess you would call that the eyebrow area, ah, it was flatter than that. . . 46:44 Art Bell: Ok. 22 46:44: Buggs: the nose was totally different, the nose was more human. 46:49 Robert: ha-Ha. . 49:49 Buggs, The ah mouth is. . . 46:50 Art Bell: Ok. 49:51 Buggs: . . .Is very, very similar. 46:53 Art Bell: Ok, what about you Robert do you have internet access where you are? 46:55 Robert: No, I’m on the line that I usually use. . . 46:58 Art Bell: (Nasal laugh) Hu- Haht. . . 47:00 Robert: The line that . . .What I am going to do, I am going to send a copy of Ah, the drawing down to you Art, and you can forward it to Buggs. . . 47:06 Art Bell: I can do that, eh, just give it a few minutes Buggs, and the rest of these. . . 47:11 Buggs: Ok the Third picture, looks just about like it . . . 47:14 Art Bell: Oh really, the third one down? 47:16 Buggs: Yeaht. . . 47:17 Art Bell: alright. . . 47:17 Buggs: It’s very, very, close. . . 47:18: Art Bell: This appears to be an actual photograph, actu. . .Its a photograph and it maybe a photograph taken from the ah, Patterson film, I’m not sure. 47:32 Buggs: that third one doesn’t look like it, that second one, I mean it is almost a dead ringer. . 47:35 Art Bell: So you’re saying that there. . . 47:36 Buggs, The third one. . I mean the fourth picture does not look like it, but the third picture is almost a dead ringer. 47:41 Art Bell: Number Three is it, then an oval. . . . 47:43 Buggs: Yep 47:45 Art Bell: You say that is almost a dead ringer for it? 47:47: Buggs: yep, Almost identical 47:51: Art Bell: Boy, I wish you could have had internet access, Robert. 47:55 Robert: yeah, ah, Unfortunately, I am talking on the line. . . 47:55 Art Bell: I’ll tell you what, Robert, ahm, why don’t I do this, ah why don’t I, If I were to drop you off the line for a few minutes. . . 23 48:05 Robert: Ok. 48:07 Art Bell: could you get it to my internet site. 48:09 Robert: I could try. . . 48:10 Art Bell: Remember now, you will be able to get on, no problem. . .W W W dot Art Bell dot Com, it will under what’s new which is the first item on the left when you load the web site, It’ll say, Uhm, Lets see here, It will say, Bigfoot images, and because we’ve got a hit here, because he says it is like number three. . 48:29 Robert: Ok. 48:32 Art Bell: if you would ah go down Ah, and take a look at number three, I would call you back in about eight minutes. 48:38: Robert: Ok, I will get on it right now. . 48:39 Art Bell: Alright let me see if I can do this properly. . . Ok, lets. 48:47 (A LOUD CLICK IS HEARD) 48:47 Art Bell: and I think that I’ve done it, let see if I can bring back Buggs, Buggs are you there? 48:55 Buggs: yeah, I’m here. 48:56 Art Bell: Ok, Good Ahm, alright Buggs, so number three is pretty close, eh? That’s . . . 49:03 Buggs: very, very close Art, the only about number three that I can see that is the difference between it and what, my, recollection is, The Ay bro area is ah, little less ah protruding. 49:15 Art Bell: otherwise, the head. . . 49:17 Buggs: the ah mouth is ah. . . 49:18 Art Bell: The mouth. 49:19 Buggs: The mouth is identical, the nose is identical. 49:23 Art Bell: wow. . . And? 49:25 Buggs: and what picture is this ah natural. 49:26 Art Bell (INTERRUPTING) How . . .ah. . I believe and I am not certain. . 46:28 Buggs: A natural picture? 49:32 Art Bell: That I believe, tha. . . Alright this was sent in just by a listener ah, but, but it doesn’t have obviously I would say It’s a real photograph that we’re looking at and judging from this, NOW, now was there, other than the ahm sex organs was there any discernable difference between the male and the female? 49:56 Buggs: that was it, Art, the male was a little taller, like I said, probably 6 or 8 inches taller and probably weighed thirty pounds more, maybe forty something, in that neighborhood. 24 50:06 UNKNOWN: um-hum. 50:09 Buggs: Aht, they were both extremely muscular ah. . . they didn’t appear to have any what I human type fat on ‘em in their, their ah abdomen area, ah, the middle age bulge, or what ever you want to call it, they, they appear to be . . .Ah. . .. Just very, very muscular type pe. . I wanted to say people but animals, I still kinda feel they are people, Art. 50:44 Art Bell: Really? 50:44 Buggs, Yeah. 50:47 Art Bell ahmt. . . . 50:49 (LOUD COUGH) 50:51 Art Bell: You ah. . . in sending me the map, Buggs, Y-you said that you’re not going to be around forever, Well, I’m not going to be around forever either, and I don’t know what to do with this, I, I don’t know what is right to do with it, I don’t know if it would result in both of us getting into trouble, even today, I’m not sure, maybe ah. . . 51:12 Buggs: Well, if you feel that you don’t need to have it, then burn it, I have a copy, my wife has a copy, ah she has the original, and, ah everything we faxed to you . . . 51:27 Art Bell: And what did you tell her about this? When you gave her, gave her the copy of the map what did you tell her? 51:32 Buggs: ah, she was in shock and awe, when I first reveal this, cause she knew nothing about it and we’ve been married for years, she knew nothing about it, until the night I talked to you on the radio . . . 51:43 Art Bell: (Sounding deflated) Oh. . . .Then you all must have had a pretty big talk about it afterwards, eh? 51:48 Buggs: LAUGHS, Oh, yeah, she wanted to go see the place, and I said, we ain’t going over there, they is no way I will go back to where that area is . . . 51:57 Art Bell: Why? 51:58 Buggs: I don’t know, Art, something scares me about it. 52:00 Art Bell: Did you end up with any of the creature’s blood on your clothing, shoes, whatever-? 52:06 Buggs: Ahhg, not that I am aware of Art. 52:08 Art Bell: Cause Blood too, has DNA in it. . 52:09 Buggs: I know Art . .If it is possible, Then moving them and all that we did, but its wasn’t something we noticed. . And my wife wouldn’t have said anything because you know, we handled coyotes and Bobcats and stuff like that we got blood on. . . 52:27 Art Bell: Ok I hear ‘ya, 52:26 Buggs: unintelligible. . 25 52: 25 Art Bell: Mike in San Angelo Texas, down there in, where he asks, ahm, “The hands, the feet, would you describe them as leathery, were the nails thick, were the ears big, was anything weird about the teeth, ah, I, ah, mean, did you, think you were looking at a meat eater, or vegetarian, any guesses?” 52:47 Buggs: I would say, just off hand a probably a vegetarian, but then again, Art, I don’t know . . . 52:55 Art Bell: Sure . . 52:56 Buggs: But then again, we are talking about a total time of me looking at these animals and burying them, ah. . I would say an hour, hour and. . . 53:02 Art Bell: Roger, 53:04 Buggs, a half, maybe two hours. . . 53:05 Art Bell: AS you guys tried to figure out what to do, right? 53:06 Buggs: Well, we knew what to do, we went and got the shovels and started digg’in. 53:11 Art Bell: yeah. . . .Ahm, what about the hands and feet, he is asking, were they leathery feeling? Do you remember any texture, can you remember anything about it? 53:20 Buggs: Art, I can’t remember, ah, other than, their hands, I don’t know how to describe them, it would be like somebody that had a pair of ah, cowhide gloves on, would have around them, then on their palm area, it was just skin type showing, kinda ah, I guess you would say leathery type ah. . . hands and the bottom of their feet was the same way, the only thing that, like I say the hands, and the bottom of their feet were probably the only thing that wasn’t covered with hair, and their face, their face didn’t IT wasn’t completely covered with hair, but then again, ah. . . 54:01 Art Bell: Pretty close to how much hair there was there on number 3? 54:04: Biggs: yeah, very similar, very similar. 54:11 Art Bell: Since that happened, since you’ve been on My show, the ah original time you appeared on my program, have you told anybody else about this? 54:20 Buggs: Yeah, there is one other person in this world that knows about it, because he had an encounter here a while back with one ah he. . . (LAUGHS) He decided he was going to follow his uncle and be a great white hunter, and one night he come across one, oh, I guess it’s been a month and a half, two months ago. . . Ah.. . .I would say about forty miles from where this happened, and he come home, telling me about it, three days later, he was SCARED. . .and then, I told him. 54:51 Art Bell: Um hum. . . 54:52 Buggs: (LAUGHS) and then he told me, that is exactly what I thought, and I said, well, why didn’t you shoot it? He said, Man, I didn’t know what it was, I got the hell outta there, pardon my French. 55:05 Art Bell: you know, when I imagine you think back on your encounter, you probably wish you had done that too, But at the time you shot that thing, initially Ah, ah, so many shots, I guess you pursue it, you don’t leave an animal out to die. . . 26 55:14 Buggs: no, ah, you’re right if it’s hunted you want to put it out of its misery, and again, Art, we thought it was a bear. Ah, just to be perfectly honest with you, I mean. . . 55:26 Art Bell: Yeah, even up until the moment you shot ah, the, the final creature dead, you still really thought it was a bear, didn’t ya? 55:35 Buggs: Oh, Yeah, yeah and I thought it was a wounded bear in the brush, bushes, that was what we was, (sic) laughing about, who is going into the thicket to get the bu. . .The bear. 55:44 Art Bell: Yeah, how did you get elected? 55:47 Buggs: I was the only one, I had the most firepower if. . .(Laughs) (unintelligible) BIRDDOG, he had a .357 and Jim, he had a .22, and I had a forty four Magnum, Ruger and ah, so You got the big gun, you go in, and I said I wanted to go. 56:05 Art Bell: By the way, I can hear something creaking, and I imagine that is your easy chair, if I had to guess 56:11 Buggs: Right, Right, It is. 56:13 Art Bell: All right Buggs, hold on. . . 56:16 OMINOUS MUSIC SIGNIFYING BREAK 56:28 Art Bell: Alright, Robert W. Morgan back and ah, Buggs and we’re not going to have Buggs for much longer, so ah, Just a couple more questions Buggs, ah and any Robert might have. Ah you could, you have given me a very detailed map, but Todd in Lakeside wants to know, “Could you actually walk to the spot where you buried ‘em, no problem?” 56:44 Buggs: Yeah, I believe I could 56:46 Art Bell: But you wouldn’t? 56:48 Buggs: No, I don’t want to go back out there Art. 56:50 Art Bell: Not even with myself and/or Robert Morgan? 56:53: Buggs: (LAUGHS) I could get you close, but I ain’t going back out there. 56:55 Art Bell: All right, ahm, two questions from ah, Ian in Charleston South Carolina, “How many times did you have to shoot the creature,” A question I think you already ah, and. . . 57:05 Buggs: I think. . .we fired three times, at the first one, and I know I fired three times at female. 57:09 Art Bell: Did it emit any kind of sound while the other one was shot, was there any reaction? 57:18 Buggs: ah. . . 57:18 Art Bell: or was it too hard to see? 57:19 Buggs: We did not see the female ah, until. . . 57:21 Art Bell: Oh, that’s right. 27 57:23 Buggs: I went into the thicket. . . 57:25 Art Bell: Ok, Ah, I’m told that you should one more time, refresh your computer screen because there are now a total of Six ah, images up there, Too bad for you Robert. . . (LAUGHS) anyway, listen you got to see the third one down, which he says, ah, is pretty dog gone close to what he saw. . . 57:42 Robert: Yeah, that’s a good one, there is nothing wrong with that. 57:46 Art Bell: You, you think that one is a fairly representative of ah, ah. . . . .what a bigfoot would look like? 57:52 Robert: Yes, yes, It very much, very close, very close. 57:57 Art Bell: Alright Robert, do you have anything? 58:00 Buggs: IF you would take the hair on number four and darken it a bit, ah, 58:07 Art Bell: That would be fairly close. 58:08 Buggs: Ah, that would be the color the hair, it’s a little too red, It a little more brown than it is than it is that Red. 58:12 Art Bell: All right. 58:14 Robert: I’ll give you a little hint on that, ah the younger ones have reddish hair the older they get the darker they get and then when they get, the old age they get of course they become grizzled, just like us. . . 58: 29 Buggs: Ok. . . Neither of these two, (ROBERT INTERRUPTS) They (sic) fifth picture, ah it’s hard to tell, I can’t see facial features, or anything, This sixth picture doesn’t look nothing like what I saw. 58:29 Robert: Yeah, (TALKS OVER BUGGS) (unintelligible), 58:43 Art Bell: Ok, so its number 3 all the way? 58:44: Buggs, Yeah. It’s got, number three, number three is almost identical. . . 58:49 Art Bell: All right, good, good. 58:50 Robert: Ah, Buggs, I am going to send you one, by which way of Art, that I think will, you’re gonna say, “Oh my God, that’s him.” 58:57 Buggs: Ok. . . 58:59 Art Bell: Ok Robert, last chance any other ah questions for Buggs? 59:02: Robert: Ah, no, no questions except that ah, I will provide though you Art, and if Anything, I can do to ah, either of you, ah Both of you, I would be more than happy to, Ah, I’m sorry that it happened . . 59:13 Art Bell: (INTERRUPTING AGAIN) he’s obviously not going back there. . . 59:19 Robert: Well, I, I, believe me Buggs, it’s hard to say, but if I went along, I think you would be fairly safe. 28 59:27 Art Bell: I wonder if you were to go there, Ah, what our liability would be. 59:30 Robert: None. . .None, there would be no problem whatsoever. 59:36 Buggs: But the problem is everybody in this part of the world knows who I am. 59:41 Robert: Well, we needn’t ah, ahm divulge where we’ve gone. 59:45 Art Bell: humph. . . 59:46 Robert: It is as simple as that . . .eah’hua (slight laugh) 59:48 Art Bell: have you, I guess over the years, that you’d maybe face jail time for this huh? 59:52 Buggs: Right, Right, et, ah. . .(unintelligible) A problem. 59:55 Art Bell: (INTERRUPTING AGAIN) My God, you would never, never be convicted of first degree anything. Cause there wasn’t but. . 1:00:00 Buggs: Yeah, well I am 56 years, Art, old right now. 1:00:03 Art Bell: were almost the same age, I’ll be 56 June 17, so. . . 1:00:07 Robert: Yes, but you know what you did was not though, You did not know it was a bigfoot, You did not fire on it as a Bigfoot, Ahm, ah, I don’t see, if you had known what it was and you fired, that was one thing, The first one you fired on was at such a distance, And it was an irrat- er a not an Irrational but an irresponsible act, but It’s done, what is done is done. Secondly, you did the other one in self-defense. . .I doubt that anyone has going to blame you for that, Ah, Ah. . . I’m sorry that that it happened, simultaneously, but I think the furtherance for science and, and also the furtherance for the protection, of the, the ah, children of these two adults that are, that are dead, Ah, the could then fit by the protection that this discovery could give them, If they are humanoid, then we can do a hell of a lot more than we are doing right now, ah, they are in imminent danger despite the laws that I have been able to initiate. Ah, It does happen and you know, education and intelligence, and intelligent application of law, is what we need. 1:01:19 Buggs: Well Robert, I, I, have one question that I’d like to ask you. 1:01:20 Robert: you. . .(unintelligible) 1:01:22 Buggs: You mentioned Arkansas, there was some creatures down in there, Is it possible, cause this happened, I would say somewheres (sic) around the middle of February. . . 1:01:30 Robert: um hum. . . 1:01:32 Buggs: IS it possible, that these animals or whatever they are, migrate from that area, . . . To Colorado? 1:01:38 Robert: Ah Buggs, there all over, there here in Montana. There in ah, ah, aht, ah, Florida, there are in Ohio, there in Pennsylvania, they are in New York, upstate New York, there in Washington, Oregon, ah, ahm, the only place I I’ve never had a real report is in Pahrump. . . 1:01:58 Buggs: NEVADA. . . 29 1:02:00 Art Bell: SAY WHAT? 1:02:01 Robert (LAUGHING PROFUSELY) In any case, they are all over the place, and they ah, do they do move quit a bit, ah, They do have unfortunately, ah, predictable to some degree, ah, aht, Movement patterns But this is, this is ah, by virtue of ah, Weather and ah, food availability, but they do have ah, they move quite a bit, what you have there are probably ah, ‘em, offshoots from, the Washita mountains, ah, ah, and that area and also, I must say in New Mexico, the highlands of New Mexico, you have a very and in the Mogollon rim of Arizona, there, there also. . . 1:02:41 Buggs: Well, see, that’s what I was wondering, if they, because if you take ‘em out and you followed the Red river all the way, you know 1:02:38 Robert: um hum. . . 1:02:52 Buggs: it would lead all the way from Arkansas to nearly New Mexico. And I was just wondering if this was a possibility, that, that this was a route that these animals travel, and that they go south in the winter, and north in the the summer. 1:03:07 Art Bell: Humm. . . 1:03:08 Robert, well they have their own routes, they don’t necessarily go by the virtue of the weather, They are perfectly adept, like you or I, ah, they don’t have to worry about the weather, when there cold, ah in fact, the colder it gets in a lot of ways, the better off they are, the ones that, I’ve encountered in Florida are much smaller, and thinner, and scrawnier and aren’t anywhere as near as healthy as the ones I’ve seen up in the northern states. 1:03:36 Art Bell: That’s a good question, did ah, these animals appear to you other than being dead, ah, to be healthy specimens? 1:03:44 Buggs: Oh yes, there were very healthy, and muscular, Ah, I’d say they were younger, younger animals than older ones , because Ah, they just appeared that they were Younger. I hate to make this a eh- (BRIEF LOSS OF SIGNAL) Ah, I don’t know the word I am looking for but the equation to this too what I would say in a human factor, and this is the one thing that scared us, And I don’t want anybody to take this wrong, but you have seen mentally retarded people, their facial features and everything, that’s what we thought we had done shot, was some mentally retarded people that was living in the wild. . . 1:04:24 Robert: Um hum. . . 1:04:25 Art Bell: Yeah. . . 1:04:28 Robert: almost brutal facial features that are Neanderthalic. Uhm, and ah little bit more so, I think. . . Ah, but Ah, gee, I wish I could reach out somehow and help you somehow. . .I really do. . 1:04:40 Art Bell, Let me be straight honest about a few things here, Number one Buggs, Ah, you don’t want your identity revealed, right? 1:04:46 Buggs: No. 1::04:48 Art Bell: Kay Number two, you don’t want to go back to the spot by yourself. . 30 1:04:50 Buggs: Nope, I think he was up in, I can take you up on a hill and show you where it’s at withing I would say, probably, a maximum of a quarter to a half a mile away. 1:05:03 Art Bell Um hum. . 1:05:05 Buggs: But I just, I have, there is something inside of me that will just not let me go back to that spot. 1:05:12 Art Bell: Yeah, I don’t think I blame you, Ah, and that is were you gave up hunting too, Alright 1:05:17 Robert: All right. 1:05:20 Art Bell: Listen Buggs . . .Thank you for coming back on here tonight . . 1:05:23 Buggs: You’re welcome Art, it and ah, I would like to explain one reason, why I’m doing this. 1:05:30 Art Bell: yeah, sure. . . 1:05:32 Robert: Iell is because of you and what you have done for all the people in this United States, you are the one person that brings forth the stuff that everybody else laughs at. 1:05:46 Art Bell: Mumm. . . 1:05:50 Buggs: Someday when I’m gone, you’ll get to laugh at them, cause you’ll have the proof. 1:05:54 Art Bell: Thank you Buggs. . 1:05:56 Buggs: Alright, Goodnight Art, Goodnight Robert 1:05:57 Robert: Good night Buggs, Good luck to you 1:05:59 Buggs: Thank you, Bye, Bye. 1:06:00 Art Bell: Ok, ah, there we go Robert. 1:06:03 Robert: Yeah, 1:06:10 Art Bell: All Right, so then, we are left with, I, I’m really left with a burden in a way because He doesn’t want to go back, Ah, He’ll will get us close, He doesn’t want to be identified, And damn it, He left me a map . 1:06:18 Robert, Yeah, well, I can’t really blame him for that, But Ah, you know, his reactions and, and, everything else shows a lot of humanity was brought out in this guy and Ah, He realizes what he’s done, and he’s ah really, really sorry for it, and ah. . . 1:06:34 Art Bell: I’m, I believe he is exactly who he sounds like he is. . . 1:06:37 Robert, Yeah, he’s . . . 1:06:38 Art Bell, Its simple as that, It is as simple as that, I have thought it, all these years and more so now. 1:06:42 Robert: The guy, ‘Ya Know if we could get, if we could get out there and get these ah bones before their totally dissolved and the Rodentia gets to them and everything like that. . . 31 1:06:53 Art Bell: Well, if you had a map peep(?) , Maybe. 1:06:56 Robert: Yeah, it’s possible and ah, if we could just do it. And get it on film and everything Like that, I think that would, it happened, It is a tragedy, It’s a tragedy, tragedy on all sides all the way around, but it sounds like we got an honest guy, Ah, he knew what the hell he was doing. . . And 1:07:11 Art Bell: That is what I thought and Ah, I hate it to see him suffering like this because he is, he is obviously carrying a lot of guilt, and I wish we could reach out and help him in some way. . . 1:07:25 Art Bell: Well, you start changing you know as you get older and you start. . . How old are you now? 1:07:29 Robert: Ah, Sixty Six. . 1:07:31 Art Bell: Ah, well you’re Sixty six, you know better than we do. . . 1:07:33 Robert: Hell, I’m meaner than cat dirt, though. 1:07:35 Art Bell (LAUGHS) 1:07:37 Robert: I bicycle, I run, I fight, I do it all, you name it, I do it all, It, it Age and all in a lot of ways is a mindset, I’ve been blessed or what ever you want to call it with absolute perfect health, and I’m as strong as I am now as I was when I was. . .when I was. . 1:07:52 Art Bell: Sure, everybody does begin reflecting though as they get older. 1:07:56 Robert: Oh absolutely, this is where wisdom comes, you know, and it’s too bad its ah comes too late, and this man, obviously going though Viet Nam, that was a very tough place to be. . . 1:08:10 Art Bell: yes it was. 1:08:10 Robert: And ah the one thing I wish I could have asked him and, I, I just is the color of his eyes he said was Red, when he got him a light. 1:08:18 Art Bell: With the light on ‘em, yeah. 1:08:19 Robert: My question was, was going to be what, were the lights of Charlie and the Viet Kong at night, because that should have given him a clue right there, but ah, you know these guys were hunting, they had reverted way back to Ah, The early days of America, and that is how a lot of guys made a living and Ah, that is what they did. . . 1:08:41 Art Bell: Yeah, that’s what early on when he was telling the story on a computer board that I watch here with fast glass, and there were coming in here, They were very judgmental. . 1:08:46 Robert: Oh yeah, Yeah, sure, 1:08:48 Art Bell: As I could imagine, but I mean look, E, Eh, you, you could sit here and pour judgmentally over what he did, and it’s not going to change anything, Ah, I wanted to get the story as it was laid out, That is how he gave it to us, right, wrong or whatever, It had. . . 1:09:05 Robert: He showed so much courage, ah, much more than, than the average person to come to the forward and tell you, ah, ah about this and then provide you with the wherewithal to reveal this and 32 you know, that if these are Humanoid, ah that he would have to stand ah charges, but the charges, I AS, I say, I doubt very seriously if anything would happen under the circumstances. 1:09:31 Art Bell: While, I but look at his thinking, he is fifty six years old now, that’s my age, Ah, ahm, a second degree, even a manslaughter charge, which would be the easiest thing I could think of, Manslaughter. . 1:09:46 Robert: Right, Right 1:09:47 Art Bell: That would put you away for some years . . .Some years. 1:09:52 Robert: AH, well, again I have to look at intent, You know, there are hunting accidents all the time, and ah, eh, these things do happen, This man was a legitimate hunter, He made an accidental difference and ahhhh, a differentiation, he made a bad judgement call, no question, However, he is coming forward and saying, Look in the interest of science, I, I could have just left it out there. I doubt a grand jury would return anything. 1:10:23 Art Bell: You know Ah, you’re probably correct, ah, umh, You are probably correct, but it would probably be a long procedure, it would be something to endeavor to do, I’ll tell ‘ya, ah, and RIGHT NOW 1:10:33 Robert: ?? 1:10:36 Art Bell: and if I could just hand them out to you, believe me, I would do that, ah, are you listening Buggs? (LAUGHS) Well, I could give the map to you, ah Robert, then ah, what would you do? 1:10:48: Well, I would go down and verify that they exist, and I would get the proper ah, scientists behind me to make sure we have a cross index, that nobody jumps any guns, and that we know exactly what the hell we are doing and we’d make a verification as to whether they are Humanoid, and ah, from that point we would have to take it from there. . . 1:11:14: Art Bell: All right 1:11:17 Robert: I just can’t, It would be such a monumental ahm 1:11:22 Art Bell: Undertaking 1:11:23 Robert: undertaking and a discovery for science worldwide, going to re-write history books, and ah, this man is making ah, ah, valiant, ah confession that ah, OK, I did something wrong, but let’s see if I can, A. Cleanse my consciousness and do something, these, these people that are buried out there are dead for no reason at this point, but At least they would have died for a reason. And ahm, Ah There’s just a, you know but what we could do is, take this to a judge in advance. . .and ask for immunity. 1:12:03 Art Bell: You know what he is going to say? . . . I, I’ll bet you ah, were not going to get it, in other words the judge would say, look, what if this is just some, he would say, I am putting myself in the judges shoes all right? I’m not about to give immunity to somebody that you may have killed two human beings, and buried them and cooked up a story that, about Bigfoot, Ahm to avoid a prosecution, I’m not going to give immunity based on that possibility, and I, I, how do you get around that one? 1:12:31 Robert: Well if we, it they turned out to be six foot tall human beings ahm, hell, you would be right, but what we are saying is under the parameters, that they would be ah, would fit the description of Bigfoot ah, etcetera, if we actually drew the parameters, and the Judge would say, alright, now look, if 33 they are found under these parameters, ah, lets, then there would be no prosecution. . . .I don’t know, It, on one hand the guy could keep his mouth shut and the hell with it, and nobody knows anything, he’s offering, he has already done that, though ah, he wants to wait until after he passes away, but he is a young man, You guys, YOU GUYS are chickens. . (FAST BREATHING AND LAUGHTER) 1:13:13 Art Bell (LAUGHING) Yeah. . . You know. 1:13:16 Robert: What are you guys talking about “Getting old” that’s non-sense and, ah. . . 1:13:18 Art Bell: Well, I mean, one never knows, forty year old drop dead all the time, Ah. Robert. . Not every body is. 1:13:23 Robert: That’s true. . . 1:13:25 Art Bell: Not everybody is ROBERT W. MORGAN. 1:13:36 Robert: (LAUGHING) 1:13:26 Art Bell: Some people realize mortality sooner rather than later, and it does happen and so. . (LAUGHING) 1:13:30 Robert: Yeah. 1:13:32 Art Bell: Some of us realize mortality sooner rather than later, hell none of us know . . .Ah, alright well, look ah. . . 1:13:37 Robert (INTERRUPTING) I were. . .(UNINTELLIGIBLE) 1:13:38 Art Bell (TALKING OVER) . . .Yeah, I know you would. 1:13:39 Robert (LAUGHING) 1:13:40 Art Bell: And if I could let you, believe me, Robert, I would. Ah, we’ll see what Buggs decides to do, if he wants you to have the information, then Buggs, let me know, otherwise, I don’t know what the hell I am going to do, let’s leave it there for a second. Now, ah, little more on bigfoot, Ah, ah, you said part of our, a step in our evolution is what you believe. . . 1:13:59 Robert: Yes. 1:14:00 Art Bell: So, then ultimately, how do you think a court would rule, if we began to have all the solid evidence we need, that there really are these creatures, and that they are somewhere in between . . .an Ape and a man. . .Ah, ah, maybe not with the, you know, he used an interesting phrase, with apologies, “Retarded” he said. . . 1:14:25 Robert Yeah. 1:14:27 So that in ah, if these creatures are what you say they are Robert, aren’t they going to have the same civil rights and protections under the . . . hell as rare as they are, probably more protections under the law. . .Than the rest of us 1:14:40 Robert: Absolutely. 1:14:44 Robert: You know, a retarded person can vote. .. 34 1:14:46 Art Bell: SURE! 1:14:46 Robert, I mean, obviously we have seen that in previous elections. . . 1:14:48 Art Bell: No but, I am talking about civil rights, the whole smear and ah, probably added protections of, beyond that, because they are obviously fairly rare, right? 1:14:58 Robert: Ah, oh, well, Absolutely, well, ah, in, comparison to the human being. . .yes . . they are very, very rare, ah absolutely, ahm but eh, ah all of our history books, all of our anthropology books, our psychology, books, everything is going to have to er makeshift because so much is involved here Ah, of the, the stuff, the pathology that we have built around our, ourselves, you know . . that we are kings of the universe you know. 1:15:25 Art Bell: Um hum. . . 1:15:25 Robert: . . .And all this other stuff, Ah, it’s going to take a major earthquake and ah, there is going to be a lot of scrambling to explain, but Ahhh, these people, yes under our Constitution they have a hallux, I think you and I have gone thought this before, but for your new listeners, they have a hallux, which is the big toe this only in humans, they have the buttocks, they, that they, we sit on, the have not **Punjunti** that is not human, they have an articulates speech that you and I have heard the recordings ah come back in which they actually repeat English words . . . 1:16:05 Art Bell: words, Yes. 1:16:05 Robert Even though they have their own language, they come back eh, using English words in a proper way. . 1:16::09 Art Bell: That is right. 1:16:09: Robert: eh, when they responded, you’re not welcome, and in that particular phrase, they were imitating what other people had said to them, it was cognitive, so here we have cognitive thought, we have ah, the opposing thumb, now we have ah, the hyoid bone, they habitually walk erect, I mean, what the hell more do you have to have, ah of course, humans have an interesting thing, every time an ape or something gets close to them they come up with a new (LAUGHS). . a new, Oh yes, but we do this, you know. The Gorilla’s are not worth a damn, they have cognitive thought, I think that is nonsense, CoCo has proven this many times over. So we’re in a bit of a dilemma here, and I think of all things, I have to agree with him, you don’t have to have your Popo padded but the fact is, I think he gave this information to the right man. . 1:17:00 Art Bell: huhht, Well thanks. 1:17:01 Robert: Now it’s your problem. 1:17:02 Art Bell: Yeah, now . . . As I said a little bit earlier, to me this is a terrible problem, I eh, eh, I, I may, might end up burning that map (LAUGHS) . . .I might end up burning it. . . 1:17:15 Robert: I hope not, ahm, I, I, hope not but ah, at the same time I think it would be well understood If you had. I am going to make sure, I send to you, if you will forward it to Buggs, a copy of that ah, Cassette of mine, I wanted him to listen to it and follow the directions, so that perhaps, perhaps Buggs if you are listening, I could teach you a way of going out and communicating with these people 35 passively. And, and something might happen for you, not to you, and that is what that tape was created for. So, I’ll send it down to Art, and I am sure He’ll send it on down to you. . . 1:17:52 Art Bell: Ah, Ah, even in view of what Buggs did, you think forgiveness, ahm would be in their repertories (LAUGHS) You, That ah. .. .If you were to get out and near one of these creatures, as I know you have done, and you know how to do, and he would come out of it alive. . . 1:18:12 Robert: Yes and I’ll tell you why. . . 1:18:13 Art Bell: With a new friend ? 1:18:17 Robert: If they wanted him, they would have walked over, at night and come through the house and gotten him. Eh, if he is that close to the river and he, he sounds like he is on a farm. 1:18:24 Art Bell: (INTERRUPTING) Have you ever seen them exhibit that kind of behavior? 1:18:29 Robert: (DEEP SIGH) Eh, ahm, you mean forgiving? 1:18:33 Art Bell: Well, well, that is a good place to go, Forgiving would be good, but ah. . .m-m-more to the point, ah you said that if they wanted him, they would have gone into his house and they would have had him a long time ago, right? 1:18:44 Robert, I, I, Yes, I think that they have a long memory, ah, I think that, ah, I’ll give you an example Skamania, County Washington, ah, there was a fellow by the name ah Sheriff Bill Clawson, and ah, I, I got to know Bill a little bit, and ah, there had been an Elk hunter killed in Skamania county not far from a town called Cougar, and ah, the fellow had killed an Elk and gone over and, and, ah, fired three more shells, that was not in that Elk, and ah, ah he was killed, he was dead, terribly. And ah, a marine happened to be in that area, of all things, a marine and he had seen something go thought the woods, and it turned out that the likely scenario was that this fellow had shot the Elk, he had tracked the Elk for about two miles He came upon ah, an apparently Bigfoot was there. He opened fire on he Bigfoot, the Bigfoot took the gun, wrapped around the dang tree, ah bent it. While Clawson was caught ahh, I believe Bill passed away now, so it’s ok to talk about it, But Ah, Clawson has an organization that was caught in a dilemma, well what are they going to say? He was killed by a Bigfoot? No, they said he had fired a gun and that the Elk had killed him . . . 1:19:58 Art Bell: Huh. . 1:19:59 Robert: And, ah, So wha(sic), what did the do? In another instance not too far from there, there was a logger that had been ahm, Chased, and after he had fired on Bigfoot, he had been chased and ah they hit him with a rock, it killed him, after he had fired on a Bigfoot. And yet, the other people had went into that area and they had ZERO problems. . 1:20:19: Art Bell: So you have seen, or ah know of behavior like that? 1:20:22 Robert: Oh yes, and at the same time I went into those identical areas, with the same Bigfoot families . . . 1:20:29 Art Bell: Yes. 1:20:30 Robert: And they left me gifts . . .So what does that tell you? They, they realized that . . . 36 1:20:34 Art Bell: Well 1:20:36 Robert: . . .were different. . 1:20:36: Art Bell: I am not sure what it tells me, It might tell me a lot of things, It tell me they are telepathic, it might suggest to me that they are telepathic . . . 1:20:43 Robert: It very easily could be. . . 1:20:45 Art Bell: Just empathic, in other words they understand the intentions, Ahm, as. . .a . . . creature does intuitively, they understand your intentions, You know, I, I can, believe me, Depending on how I approach my cats, they will either take off running . . 1:21:03 Robert: um hum. . . 1:21:03 Art Bell: or they will, will, purr and throw themselves on their backs and their bellies in the air, so they can be scratched, right? 1:21:07 Art Bell: And rubbed, that is what they love. But if you come to them the wrong way, your, eh they can tell as you’re coming up on them. . . Ah, Stalk a cat and see what it does . . . 1:21:17 Robert: Oh yeah! 1:21:17 Art bell: (LAUGHING) 1:21:19 Robert: Well, the funny thing Is that, ah see, this is why, I never again, guns, I ask people to never take a gun, or believe it or not, a camera, don’t take it with you. . . 1:2128 Art Bell: A camera? 1:21:30 Robert: No, and here is what is the reason why, what do you do with a camera? 1:21:35 Art Bell: You take a picture. . . 1:21:35 Robert: That’s right. But what do you do with it physically? You raise it to your face. 1:21:38 Art Bell: And shoot, Yes. 1:21:40 Robert: Yeah, and shoot. 1:21:41 Art Bell: Oh! 1:21:42 Robert: Get it? 1:21:43 Art Bell: yep. . . 1:21:46 Robert: How in the hell do they know what you are raising, that is a mechanical device, and you raise it up towards you face, and you point it at ‘em. 1:21:50 Art Bell: Good point. 1:21:51 Robert: just like a gun . . . 1:21:52 Art Bell: Yeah. . 37 1:21:55 Robert: and that Is why most people don’t get pictures . . . it takes a very rare, ah instance to get a picture. . 1:22:00 Art Bell: Are you a believer in the Patterson film, you think that was a real thing. 1:22:03 Robert: Oh I ah ah, if you will recall, I showed you the other two ah, bigfoot in that ah film 1:22:08 Art Bell: Oh yes, I know, I remember, yes, some course . . .. 1:22:11 Robert (INTERRUPTING) so, so. 1:22:12 Art Bell: I am not asking you for new audience here. 1:22:13 Robert: Ah, Oh I see, I am so sorry, ahm A lot happened in that film, and they came up with this nonsense at all, the suit had been made by ah Hollywood guy. Let me tell you something if he had made a ah, suit that well with muscles moving in it, he would have sold that suit, cause Hollywood had nothing anywhere near like that Number one, Number two, If he was playing a joke on Patterson how did he know Gimlin wasn’t going to shoot him? 1:22:39 Art Bell: ah. . . 1:22:40 Robert: Number three did Patterson, do it? Hell no, he didn’t have enough money for that sort of thing, he had enough trouble feeding his family so, Number four we discovered cause there was something wrong with the way that female acted, she walked away in the middle, she didn’t run for the forest, that has bothered me, and as I told you adopted father, Nino Cochise finally kept pointing and told me hey dummy, you are looking in the wrong area. So we ah, one night when I was working on the ah, ahm eclipse and looking through it, I accidently went off of color and I was looking at black and white and I scanned backwards and I found the young ah, ahm, baby. 1:23:18 Art Bell: That is Right. . .very clear by the way. 1:23:19 Robert: And, ahm he he’s sitting down, just like a little kid, he has got his hand up around the thing, and she is walking away from her baby. . . 1:23:28 Art Bell: um hum. 1:23:29 Robert: and then, we look ahead of her and here is this male, leaning out watching, now, now hell, what is she doing? She is saying, Ok two white guys, follow me and I am going to take you to big daddy. . . 1:23:44 OMINOUS MUSIC BREAK 1:23:54 Art Bell: Alright Back to Robert W. Morgan, we are going to get you on a line with him in just a second. . .Shannon in ah, Orange county asks, “Could you possibly ask Robert to email you the complete description, illustration of the child bigfoot and male bigfoot in Patterson film and would you post that?” Your Website isn’t up right now is it? 1:24:11 Robert: NO IT’S NOT, but I can be, ah, I can give you an email address. It’s R W M the numeric four. 1:24:18 Art Bell: Right. 38 1:24:19 Robert: Big sky? 1:24:21 Art Bell: At big Sky? 1:24:22 Robert: Big sky at AOL dot COM. R W M Numeric four bigsky at AOL. 1:24:31 Art Bell: At AOL. 1:24:32 Robert: AT AOL and that ah Big Sky, that is ah, ah Montana. 1:24:35 Art Bell: Got Cha, Ahm, Ok Ah, when do you anticipate you might get your website up again? 1:24:41 Robert: Ah, Well ah I am working on with ah, Scot Velasco at ah Artists first ah group. That is the folks that are handling my cassette, and they are working with Steve, and we expect, probably within the next week or so we should have our website back up. . . 1:24:56 Art Bell: Let me give you a good plug for your, your cassette too, what is on there? 1:24:59 Robert: Oh? The cassette, this is ah, the first half of it on the audio cassette is an actual experience that ah, had taken place in Ohio, and I am talking about this is recorded by Scott Church, this is ah A full ah, theatre type thing, In other words you actually experience what we experienced. The second half of the cassette, that the other half will tell you step by step what you can do, so you can do, what I do. If you follow it exactly the way I ah. . . . 1:25:29 Art Bell: Which is coming face to face with a Bigfoot. . . 12:35:30 Robert: That’s right, if you handle it correctly, Now, we have sixteen people so far in ah, Good God, we have sold over 5,000 of these, It is very difficult, it is not an easy thing, You don’t just go out and stroll for five seconds, and. . . 1:25:44 Art Bell: But you are saying you have sixteen people that have done it? 1:25:48 Robert: Yes, they have come forward and they have told, now I have asked each one of them, and so far they have all declined to have ah, themselves, ah their name revealed. 2:25:56 Art Bell: Now see, there you are, ah, en. . Now, now you are having people declining just a witness report, right? 1:26:03 Robert: Right. . 1:26:03 Art Bell: Attaching their name to it. 1:26:05 Robert: exactly. . . 1:26:05 Art Bell: So, understand what the situation is with Buggs, people understand, AH! It’s no big deal. . . 1:26:09 Robert: Oh sure, I have hundreds of them. . . like that. 1:26:10 Art Bell: Wrong, it is a big deal. 1:26:12: Robert: But, IF they follow the cassette, if they follow what I ask them to do, they if they, they do their research the chances are, and can I give the address on that? 39 1:26:22 Art Bell: Ah, ah, is there a phone number? 1:26:23 Robert: Yes, it is 8 8 8, 1:26:26 Art Bell: Right. 1:26:26 Robert 2 9 5 2 7 8 7. 1:26:30 Art Bell: What do they ask for? 1:26:35 Robert: And ah, well they’ll answer the phone, this is artists first, they ask for the Robert W. Morgan ah, a ahm Ultimate adventure, Bigfoot, the ultimate adventure. 1:26:40 Art Bell: All right, how much is it? 1:26:41 Robert: Ah, hell, I don’t know what they are charging right now, (LAUGHS) I have no idea. I think its ten ninety, or ah Ten Dollars, I believe it is. 1:26:46 Art Bell: All of Ten Bucks, alright Ahh 1-888-295-2787? 1:26:53 Robert: Right, and they can go to the web site directly, ARTISTS FIRST DOT COM ONE WORD, ARTISTSFIRST DOT COM and ah. . . it’s quite an adventure it really is. 1:27:01 Art Bell: All right, I have got a lot of people who would like talk to you. . So let’s rock, First time caller, you’re on the line with Robert W. Morgan, Hi 1:27:13 UNKNOWN CALLER: Hello? 1:27:14: Art Bell: Hello. 1:27:14 UNKNOWN CALLER: Hello, yes. 1:27:15 Art Bell: Where are you? 1:27:17 UNKNOWN CALLER: I’m in Lansing Michigan. . 1:27:18 Art Bell: Ok, fire away. 1:27:17 UNKNOWN CALLER: Ahm, I was calling to fin. . .to ask him, I know that Buggs asked when he first spotted the BIGFOOT that they had a bright deep big red ah eyes. 1:27:29 Art Bell: That’s Right. . 1:27:29 UNKNOWN CALLER: If they were human like, wouldn’t the eyes be non-reflective? 1:27:35 Robert: Probably they would not be. . .ah but at the same time, I have ta, I wanted to ask him what the color of eyes of a human beings’ eyes are if you hit them directly in the eyes. . .Have you ever seen photographs taken, and what do you get out of a human eye? 1:27:50 UNKNOWN CALLER: It’s kinda this, I remember every once in a while you get like a blue or a greenish color. 1:27:55 Robert: or you might get a red dot, also, its according to the frequency of the light that you are using, I’m, Im pretty sure that is what the situation. 40
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