Transcript of Interview Tom: 2:07:00pm: Okay, so I just want to start. Do you have any identification to provide us with ? Richard: 2:07:12pm: D o I need any. Tom: 2:07:14pm: Uh, we just like to keep them on file for the situations. Richard: 2:07:19pm: Okay, h ere's my driver's license. Tom: 2:07:23pm: Um, the reason you here today is just , you ma y be charged with discharg e of material into the Scugog River, City of Kawartha Lakes , Ontario t hat may impair the quality of water c ontrary to secti on 31 of the Ontario W ater R esources A ct. Tom: 2:07:40 pm: Do you understand the charge? Richard: 2:07:41 pm: Am I being charged or something? Tom: 2:07:45pm: You're being charged with the discharge of material into the S cugog River, City of Kawartha Lakes That I just mentioned? Richard: 2:07:53pm: So, I am being charged, or I may be charged. Tom: 2:07:56pm: You may be charged. Richard: 2:07:58pm: Okay, so I'm not being charging. Tom: 2:08:04pm: You may , do you understand the charge? Richard: 2:08:05: Yeah, I, I didn't do anything, but. Tom: 2:08:10pm: You wish to say anything in answer to the charge , you're not obliged to say an ything unless you wish to do so. B ut whatever you say, may be given i n evide nce. Richard: 2:08:18pm: I don't know anybody Tom: 2:08:25pm: Do you understand the caution I have read to you ? Richard: 2:08:29pm: I guess Tom: 2:08:35pm: Um, have you spoken to any provincial officer, or anyone with authority, or any such person that's spoken to you in connection with this case ? I want to , I w anted you to clearly understan d that I do not want it to influence you in the making of any statement. That understood? Richard: 2:08 :51pm: T his is the first I 've heard of what I'm talking to anybody. Tom: 2:08:56pm: Okay, so, where were you on the day of February 25th, 2022, a t approximately 11 : 0 0 am ? Richard: 2:09:07pm: T hat's a long time ago. I have no idea. Tom: 2:09:08pm: You don't remember okay, I'll just bring up something here. Tom: 2: 09:16pm: Can you guys see that? Richard: 2:09:20pm: Okay. Tom: 2:09:23pm: Is it showing for you on this screen? Richard: 2:09:27pm: I don't know som e guy walking in the snow with a pail Tom: 2:09:30pm: Y ou telling me that's not, you ? Richard: 2:09:33pm: I can't really see Tom: 2:09:35pm: No Tom: 2:09:38pm: This person , they drove up and a vehicle For d F 250 license plate WV2 972. Y ou're telling me that's no your vehicle ? Richard: 2:09:50pm: I don't know what my license number is. I've got a red truck. Tom: 2:09:54pm: It's registered to a Rick Hut ter, 17 Adelaide S treet South , Lindsay, Ontario , K9V 4KA Tom: 2:10:06pm: That matches your driver's license, does it not? Richard: 2:10:07pm: So, you got a picture of my truck why ask ing me a questio n if you knew the answer ? Tom: 2:10:13pm: I was just asking if you remember the, the situation where you were at this time. Richard: 2:10:18pm: I don't remember . That could be taken any time. Tom: 2:10:24pm: The d ate on the bottom of the picture there desc ribes 11 : 0 0 am , 25th of February 2022. Richard : 2:10:31pm: All right, so, you know, more than I do. Tom: 2:10:35pm: You were see n carrying 2 buckets down to the Scugog River and dumping a substance. Is that correct? Or do you still not remember. Richard: 2: 10:45 pm: I don't know what you saw. Tom: 2:10:48pm: Is this not you ? Richard: 2:10:51pm: Co uld be Tom: 2:10:54pm: And labelled, bucket labe l led bad stuff. Do you not drink? Richard: 2:11:00pm: I don't know, it looks lik e I’m um fishing. That's my fishing pai l. Tom: 2:11: 05pm: That doesn't look like fishing to me. It looks like someone dumping something into the river. Richard: 2:11:09pm: Oh o one pail got fish guts, the other one I ’m carry my fishing stuff in it Richard: 2:11:13pm: Now we know , w e ’ve solve the crime Tom: 2:11:16pm: S o you caught, you p lace claim to those buckets that you retrieve from the back of your truck? Richard: 2:11:24pm: What's that ? Tom: 2:11:25pm: You’re placing claim that you own those buckets from that you , you grab bed from the back of your truck ? Richard: 2:11:28pm: It looks like me, I have 2 pails like that. I take fishing with me One, I put the old fish guts and when I clean them, and I dump them in to the river , that way, I can pull the leeches off the guts and I can use them for fishing next time. Tom: 2:11:46 pm: So, this picture right here, you're telling me it's fish guts? Richard: 2:11:49pm: That's what it looks like to me Tom: 2:11:51 pm: W e ra n some tests at our lab and it came back as the substance (...... ) You know, anything about that ? Richard: 2:11:57pm: Always a bet, man, I say you probably made a mistake and that's okay. You want me to do it again. Tom: 2:12: 04 pm: The lab s doesn't make mist akes. Tom: 2:12:07pm: And, so Richard: 2:12:09pm: You know what? Let's agree to disagree on that one because I know what I did, it was fish guts. You're calling it something else. Tom: 2:12:15pm: Okay. Richard: 2:12:16 pm: You got the .... Not me Tom: 2:12:17pm: Okay Richard: 2:12:18pm: But I know is f ish guts , so it's not all for today. Tom: 2:12: 23pm: The chemical makeup do not match with fish guts. Richard: 2:12:28pm: Yeah, whatever I know what it is. Is there anything else ? Tom: 2:12:34pm: What about March 4th, 2022 at about 1 : 30 to 2 :0 0 PM. Do you remember that day or not ? Richard: 2:12:41pm: Nope Tom: 2:12:44pm: D oes this individual with the red truck in the background the same one as the previous day in February 25th 2022? Richard: 2:12:52pm: Listen Tom: 2:12:57pm: You claimed ownership to those buckets. Did you not ? Richard: 2:12:58pm: Or Ma y be? Tom: 2:12:59pm: M aybe the same buckets. Richards: 2:13:02pm: I don't see any thing I can hardly see the guy in the background. Richard: 2:13:12pm: I don't know what you're going at here Tom: 2:13:13 pm: A close picture of , t he same you in the same picture with another a ccompli sh, but we'll get to him in a bi t. Tom: 2:13:24pm: So you were making yourself , mak ing your way down to the Scugog R iver again with the same 2 buckets marked with the same mark ing s , toxic and bad stuff. Is that correct? Richard: 2:13: 36pm: I don't know. Probably go ing fish ing again. Tom: 2:13:41pm: You dumped a similar substance, a nd actually, the exact same substance as the first time, which is ... dye, which is not fish guts Richard: 2:13:49pm: W hich is fish guts not whatever you said, but you're gonna, you're gonna serve m e anyway on this one Tom: 2:13: 58pm: Chemical makeup of that does not match that of fish guts. Richard: 2:14:02pm: Well, we'll agree to disagree on this one , what else you go t? Tom: 2:14:07pm: The individual that I showed a p icture of in the background her e , do you know who he is? Richard: 2:14:14pm: No. Tom: 2:14: 16pm: See, you just walk ing with someone you don't know. Richard: 2:14:20 pm: There's every once i n a while, there's some clown down there, he wants to find out where I fish. Richard: 2:14:25pm: I don’t know who he is. Tom: 2:14:28pm: I don't know, I gue ss it's another way to fish is dumping something in the water instead of with a fishing rod ? Richard: 2:14:31pm: Do you need a cue tip? I said, I put the fish guts in the pail from home. And I take them and I toss them in the reverse and get the leeches off. Tom: 2:14:41pm: Did you not say that you were down there and then a client comes up to you while you're fishing? Richard: 2:14:46pm: Yeah, that guy, that's the old guy. I see him down there before. He's always trying to find out where I catch the fish and I won't tell him. Have you ever gone fishing? Tom: 2:14:54pm: Oh, maybe a few times. Richard: 2:14:56pm: Do you give away your spots to any anybody who's bugging you for. So mebody asked you for your sponsor, Tom: 2:15:03pm: D epends on the population there, but that's beside the point. Tom: 2:15:07pm: H e showed up that day in a Ford F 250, like yours, white. Right here , license pla te, AY 23355 You c an see there that's license to Jim Shockey. You don't know him ? Richard: 2:15:24pm: No Tom: 2:15:28pm: N ot at all. Richard: 2:15:29pm : No, no t at all. I don't know who he is. I didn't ask him. Tom: 2:15:32pm: You'v e never met with him previously? Richard: 2:15:35pm: No Tom: 2:15:38pm: A re you sure about that? Richard: 12:15:40pm: I'm sure about that. Tom: 12:15:44pm: You two were obser ved exchanging currency. At , at the site. Tom: 2:15:55pm: At this moment here he provided, we have recordings audio recordings that h e provided you with 500 dollars that day? What's that f or? Richard: 2:16:02pm: I don't hear any recording , play it for me. Tom: 2:16: 07pm: I'll just pull it up for you. Tom: 2:16:14pm: A second here. 2:16:27pm: Audio recording playing ...f or long time, so it's not bad. So, it's history, it's good. I sure could use the money. I'll give you another 500 today. 2:16:42pm Audio recordings paused. Tom: 2:16:44pm: Said you sure could use the money . W as that not you saying that ? Richard: 2:16:49pm: Okay, I'm not going back to jail. Just go out after the other guy , okay. Tom: 2:16:56pm: Who ? Who? W ho is the o the r guy ? Richard : 2:16:58pm: I don't know, but he's the guy , pull his truck Tom: 2:17:03pm: Was registered to a Jim S hock ey you telling me you've met him and you never introduced yourself or anything ? Richard: 2:17:09pm: Look at I just got out of jail and I ain't going b ack. Okay, I I worked for him. Sometimes I met him in the bar, h e gives me cash and he goes away. I guess you haven't been in prison out of, you. Tom: 2:17:22pm: No, but wha t's the reason he gives you cas h? Richard: 2:17:27pm: Because I get rid of that stuff for him, but I'm not going to jail. He's the guy you want. Not me Tom: 2:17:32pm: W hat is the stuff you said it was just your fish guts from home? Richard: 2:17:35pm: I didn't know what it is. He said it's not toxic not to worry about it. Tom: 2:17:38pm: Not to worry about him ? Tom: 2:17:41pm: Okay. Tom: 2:17:43pm: Em So , the individual gave you 500 dollars that day what was the grand total he was going to pay you ? Richard: 2:17:50pm: That's it Tom: 2:17:52pm: H e said just today, he's going to give you 500. T hat wasn't it. Richard: 2:17:56pm: Well, if I go do some more, but if I think if I know it's bad and I'm not going to do it anymore. I'm not going back to jail. Tom: 2:18: 03pm: We have with, y ou've du mped it, so you've caused a, um a n imp airment on the quality of the water that you’re dumping it. Richard: 2:18:14pm: But he is the guy you want not me I'm not going back. I just got out of jail . I have 5 kids, 5 ex - wives. That's expensive. You , have you ever been to jail? Tom: 2:18:26pm: No , I can’t say I have. Richard: 2:18:27pm: Okay, well, when you get out of jail, nobody'll hire you. I got to make a living. Somehow. I got no income. I got to do what I have to do. Tom: 2:18:35pm: And still, no excuse Richard: 2:18:35 pm: I don't know anym ore, but he's the guy who want not me. Tom: 2:18:43pm: He stated that he worked for Shockey I ndustries on E agle S treet. You don't know the company ? Richard: 2:18: 48pm: Not really, Tom : 2:18:49pm: B ut he explained it to you in the address he sent to you Richard: 2:18:53pm: Hey listening, j ust keep me out of it. Go after him. Tom: 2:18:59pm: How long have you been doing this for him? Richard: 2:19:01pm: That's the first time Tom: 2:19:03pm: The firs t time? Are you sure ? Y ou've done it twice? Here? We have pictures of you. Tom: 2:19:15pm: It doesn't matter if you just got out of jail, you ’re not immune to the law when you get out of jail. Richard: 2:19:20pm: I made a mistake, but what am I supposed to do ? Five ex - wives, five kids I got to feed. Tom: 2:19:24pm: Still, no excuse. Richard: 2:19:29pm: What else go after him? It's not me you want, it’s him Tom: 2:19:31pm: I f you want me to go after him tell me all about him. Richard: 2:19:34pm: That's all I know. Tom: 2:19:36pm: That's Richard: 2:19:37pm: You found me with my truck, go after him Tom: 2:19:43pm: Okay, um. Richard: 2:19:48pm: Can I go now? Tom: 2:19:53pm: So you're admitting this isn't fish guts because he provided it to you ? Richard: 2:19:58pm: I don't know what it was. Tom: 12:20:01pm: Okay, but I just want to establish you don't know what it was that for you .... Richard: 2:20:04pm: Now I do know, I'm not going back to jail. Can I go now? Tom: 2:20:08pm: That's still up for the jury to deci de. Tom: 2:20:15pm: You're free to leave at any time. Richard: 2:20:20pm: Go after him. Tom: 2:20:21pm: W e'll go after whoever's appropriate. 2:20:23pm Interview Ends.