Hello and welcome to episode three of the Flame Cast, the Hot UK Deals podcast. Today we're joined by Darren, who is featured on the last couple of podcasts. Hi Darren. Hey Jason. And we have a brand new voice on the podcast. Today we have Vanessa joining us from mydealz. Hi Vanessa. Hey Jason. Would you like to say a few words and introduce yourself? Sure. I'm Vanessa, community Manager for mydealz the German part of Pepper. That's great. Thank you Vanessa. So we're just going to, we have a few general topics that we'd like to go through today, mainly focused around moderation and Darren and Vanessa will be taking us through those. So first of all, Vanessa, over to you again, just like to hear from you about your, your role as a community manager in Germany and exactly what, what it involves. It involves a lot of things, to be honest. Yeah. For start I am responsible for the daily business. All the process that everything is working well with the team, but also with the community. If there are problems that is raising the team or the community, I'm responsible for finding solutions. And of course also deescalation things when members are unhappy with our moderation. Also cross departments working like. Talking with our editorial team, our partnership team, our CEO marketing team for yeah, working together the best we can. That's great. How, how do you fit it all in a day? It's difficult to fit all in one day but if you're organized well, it, it's, it's manageable. That's great. In terms of the role itself, are, are there any, which parts in particular do you find the most rewarding or do you find the most enjoyable? I think everything related to the community is the things I enjoy the most because it's always a pleasure to make a user happy. Even though sometimes it, it's hard when there are problems and users are not really satisfied with our decisions. In the end, it makes me really happy if I can explain things better and in the long run, of course, the community then understands also better our decisions and the reward system. Of course, it's also something that that's really nice to, to do. It's probably natural for me to ask the things that you dislike the most, but I think as this, as we get talking in this podcast, there are certain areas which we'll cover, which we'll, we'll, you know, circle back to in terms of the, the things which are probably not as enjoyable as keeping your community happy and vibrant and, and engaged. So I think it's quite important to point out that your role isn't just managing your your community or making sure that your community are looked after and happy. So in terms of. Managing teams, something Darren has has done for so many years. Inspiring teams for career progression. That's a big question. And to everything that Vanessa's just said, you know, for anyone that's done anything around being a community manager or managed any type of social space you know, Vanessa's condensed a very complicated, multi-faceted job into, you know, a, a nice sound bite, but actually there's so much to it, you know, and I think. We all recognize that the, the evolution of communities and the people that come to our communities constantly changes. You know, the, the social media landscape has definitely changed, you know, even since Covid, you know, different, you know, world picture views come into, into communities quite a lot. And that makes the community manager's role quite complicated. You know, it's really important to stay on top of everything that's going on. But in terms of specifically building teams I think we, you know, we look at sort of two things really. First is the sort of moderation approach, which is something that all of our teams across, you know, all of our communities, you know, spend a large amount of their time working on. So it's how do we scale that? How do we keep control, you know, of what's happening and still allow, you know, users to engage with each other and have a, have a voice in the community. But the other part is the actual, the kind of community management piece. So. When we talk about that, we mean building relationships with our members. You know, we mean taking time sometimes to, you know, not just look at a reported post or a reported action, but to look a little bit wider in terms of how that affects our entire community. And what that really boils down to is when we're building like a career map for people, it's understanding that. You know, for us it's really important that we're able to move from that first one, which is a moderation first approach to the second part, which is, you know, how do we give people time as well to be good community members, community teams, community managers, and the type of skills that they'll need. Obviously for, you know, the role, the role that people like Vanessa. Do, you know, part of that is learning to be a leader as well. You know, I'm super pleased to say that. In my experience, the community management space has a, a large representation of female, powerful female figures, which I think is great for our industry. And I think Vanessa, you've also done a female leadership course recently, I think, which is, you know, which is really great to see as well. And it's really, you know, when we look at the wider team as well, it's identifying skills that the team have, so the things they're passionate about or things they really, really wanna work on or things that we can help them with. So we are constantly thinking about the evolution of, you know, taking people from pure moderators to maybe. Community managers but also have a specialty in things like data or, you know, things like brand building or how we work with marketing. There's 1,000,001 things we can involve people on as well. And I really, I guess the point, Jason, is to kind of map all those things down and, and give people a clear idea of, you know, how we go from sort of moderation task focused to how we look at the bigger picture in terms of, you know, what we do that makes our communities so inspiring and powerful and, and important and, and really that. Is all under Vanessa's remit with her team. And some of the stuff that, you know, we are constantly working on to, to make sure we can make that happen really for our communities. That's great. One, one, just listening to you saying that one, one thing I'm personally proud about and the, the fact that Pepper does it, is that most of our community support teams came from within the community when we hired them. So they, they get community, they know what the platform's about and they, and they know what our users would want to see. And I guess that. Coming back to the challenges we face, having to kind of moderate the, the content which you might have been posting to yourself as a member a few years ago is, is very difficult. So maybe that might come back to the question I was about to ask earlier about what is it you most dislike a about the role, Vanessa? I think it's hard to say. There's one thing I really dislike about the role. I think more the organizational stuff is really boring. It's nothing that I really enjoy it, it has to be done, of course. But it's nothing that makes me really happy. Yes. That, that, that having wroted for, for so long, it, it doesn't surprise me. I guess in terms of talking about challenges, With the community content and how you manage it, what would you say would, that would be the biggest challenge? I think the biggest challenge is to take the right decision in a short time because we have a really big workload. We don't have sometimes the time to read through all the comments where the arguments started for, for know how we can moderate it's best. So sometimes because of, because it's lack of time, we are deleting comments. Where we could maybe do a better job in just moderating transparent on the website instead of deleting, leading a discussion to a good direction again. But sometime even it's any way hard to take the right decision when you're deleting a comment, then the person who wrote the comment is unhappy about it because it gets. Gets deleted. If we don't delete it, maybe someone else is feeling offended by it because the tone is really rude and it's really a balance balancing point where you don't really. We are not really sure sometimes if this is the right decision you are taking. So yeah, we are also just human excuses If we sometimes maybe don't take the right decision, and I think it's important to say as well that you know, our communities. Are millions of people and you know, a huge amount of interactions that happen. You know, all of our community teams are actually, and this is true of most moderation teams or community management teams, they're actually relatively small in the grand scheme of things. And you know, we put obviously really robust processes in place and we're constantly reviewing things like our publication rules. We're pretty touch on the code of conduct. I think we were gonna mention as well today, but you know, that that team is still, I think we touched on this last time, Jace, but these are. Human beings, right? Like your team, Vanessa, have, you know, emotions. They have good days, bad days, like we all do. And sometimes I think it's very easy to, you know, just vocally criticize without actually understanding how difficult it is at scale to try and make every single decision to be the right one. And as we know, you know, Our communities represent all of society. So people listening to this, there's things that people will love and hate and that's different from every single person. So as a moderator, as a community manager, you know, how do you get that line accurate the whole time? And I mean, in the time that you've been with the team, Vanessa, have you sort of seen that shift? Does it change a lot in your experience here? Are there always like new challenges of things for moderation to consider with your team? Yeah, especially when are big things happening like Covid, Ukraine war or other things in our society that are going through social media. Of course all the time. Then the people also talk in the commons about these kind of topics and it's always difficult to be. To, to know what's going on at the moment. So you always have to read the news to know about what the people are really talking about for taking the right decisions. And also it's something that like Covid or the Ukraine War, the people are not feeling really fine at the moment and they are also. You'll see it in the comments they are writing, and sometime we are the same. We are not feeling fine with the situation, and it's really hard to take decision and read that all day again and again and again. Yeah, when, when you consider how large our communities are, but what our platform is, our platform is essentially a, you know, a shopping channel, but it's a massive platform where users feel they can come to us for discussion. So when you have a, a community as large as ours, you cannot expect them just to come to us and talk about deals and vouchers and, you know, products. They, they, they, they believe our space is somewhere where they can just come and have discussions with friends. So it would be so simple to, to one day rewrite the rules and say, you can only talk about shopping. But when you have communities as large as ours, the ex, you cannot expect users just to come to us for that type of discussion. It's a platform where they can, within the rules, they should be able to discuss freely what they, what they want to, as long as they know that there's a, you know, a point at which, you know, the discussion has to stop or they, or they're not being mindful of somebody else's belief or opinion or their soapboxing. So these are the. These are the biggest challenges we face and I, and I suppose it's something that online forums have have faced for years and years, and they'll probably be facing it in years to come. So it's just how can you sensibly manage that content on your platform and be able to respect, you know, the integrity of the platform, but respect everyone else too. Yeah, I, I think that's right. So I mean, I was, I was also curious in terms of, you know, I guess mental health gets touched along, along with, you know, things like moderation and that, and obviously our teams get exposed to, you know, sometimes unpleasant content. Sometimes just, I think you touched on it, Vanessa, the, the repetition of like, for every person it might be their only, Interaction or their only comment. But actually when you're dealing with broader topics, they come up again and again. Right? So for part of the team, it's like, it's almost remembering to reset every time and treat it as the next thing that turns up in a moderation queue, you know, with the same level of compassion and empathy and those type of things. So like how do you, how do you think the teams, what are our, what are dangers around not paying attention to the team's mental health as well? Yeah, I think it's mental health is a really big topic in, in moderation. It's, it's really important when you feel that you take things personal or that you're worried about things, that you talk about it, that you, you go to your manager or to someone else and you that you really talk about it and that you have maybe the time to step back and get a little bit distant from it. Because if you. If you see it and read it every single day, of course one day you're really into it. And you need to be distant and also think it's, it's normal that the people talk about it and we have to handle it in some way. But we te we have one-on-ones how often it's possible and I think, anyway, we have a lot of nice community members who are supporters in this kind of way, and always help us in difficult situation also with arguments and yeah, mental health. Anyway, it's a difficult topic for everyone behind the scenes, just for, for those unaware, and not, not that you might be aware, but we have so for example, we have Vanessa with us today, and she's over from Berlin. We have a couple of colleagues. So. In terms of the culture at Pepper, we try to bring people and have conversations with people as frequently as possible, and that's why we like doing what we're doing. In terms of the community, we have the we have some editor assistance on the platform, which work closely with us in terms of looking at content, which might be improved through their expert input. We have ambassadors, which we are going to be relaunching in the next few months, so that's something that we'll be bringing a another. A podcast to you in a, maybe in a few months time to talk about the role of ambassadors on the platform, but as, as Vanessa said, it's, it's so vital that we have this. Ability to have conversations with people as, as frequently as possible. And, and we hope that that's what users like to come to our platform for. Which again, we, the challenges we face in terms of you, you read on the news about various topics around the world and, and some people might not want to come to the hockey care deals or my deals or deal labs be met with the same conversation that they could be picking up on, on various news channels. So we have to be very mindful of that as well. So Vanessa, what are your, what are your favorite things, just in terms of the com you, you've kind of grown up with this community as well, you know, the last few years as it's grown. So what are the things that just make you like unexpected things that make you really smile about the community or, you know, when you've had a really good week and you look back at like, some of the successes. I mean, you touched on member relationships and that, but there must be, there must be times where you think that was, that's a lovely thing that have happened to a result of our community. I think. The thing that, that make me smile the most, if I get messages from users who post the first deal and they, they tell me that they are so happy that they could give back something to the rest of the community. Giving someone the opportunity to buy a product that maybe was too expensive for the normal price and they were so happy just to, to give back things. And this, this always makes me smile. Yeah. And that's, I think that's the, the important thing about our communities is, you know, we, we live in a very, I would say, difficult time at the moment, you know, for a lot of reasons. And, you know, the, the whole cost of living crisis for a lot of people is a very real and present challenge. So I think it's, you know, it's getting people, encouraging them to. Post for the first time, and hopefully we continue to evolve the way we make that happen and to make it as easy as possible and for it to feel like an inclusive culture. But it's also, you know, for the people on the other end of that is to get the deal and then to save money or whatever it might be. And for a lot of people, I think for us it's being mindful that, you know, some of these deals do really make a difference, right? They do change people's lives where, you know, for whatever reason it might have been something that was unattainable before. So I think that is a lovely example you've given of just. You know, the, just the sense of pride or the sense of community actually, that people get from doing this stuff and it's super important. Yeah, exactly. So in terms of the future, Vanessa, how would you or how do you see communities evolving? I think first of all, communities are really important because we get the real opinion of a person who bought the product, who tested the product. And I think right now, if we see Instagram and all of that kind of stuff and marketing things, you don't really know anymore if you really wanna buy it because the review is, Spot mm-hmm. By someone. And I really love that of our community because you get real opinions, not of someone that is paid for a company. And yeah. Regarding our reward system, we, of course, when, when people. Thank you for posting a deal and they feel that they are also appreciated by us. Hopefully, we are getting more and more deals and more and more people are saving money on products. So in, in the long run, it's good for everyone. For the people who post the deal, for the people that can buy the product of the deal and yeah. And Vanessa, you touched on the, the sort of rewards program, which is probably a good, a good reason or a good point. Just to bring this up really in terms of what we are doing as a team. So rewards and recognition, which is the kind of area of the business that we're talking about, is really looking at, you know, how we not just incentivize people. Cause I think that's not really the message we want to give, but actually is when people take these amazing actions. This to just be better and build a better ecosystem around how we do say thank you for the things that people do. How we do motivate people to, like you said, take their first deal, post their first deal, you know, but getting them to then feel confident to post their second, third, fourth, fifth. You know, we've got some people on the site that have posted just crazy levels of deals and those people are amazing, but just really getting, you know, Getting it to be like a cultural thing for people so they feel confident to keep doing it. And you know, not every deal is gonna be, you know, a thousand heat, you know, some of them won't be, but they're all really important as well. So I think that part of it is, is like super exciting for us as well. Right. And just being able to recognize the great work that people do for us. Yeah, I remember When I wrote my first deal and I was so afraid about the reactions of the community. Yeah. What was it, what was your deal? What was your first deal? Oh, I, I'm not sure even what, what it was. It was some random product. I just wanted post a deal for, for start because I was always afraid of the reactions. And yeah, in the end I was totally happy and I posted more, more, more deals. Now, I don't have the time anymore, sadly, but it's really hard for first. Time user to post the deal because our community is also really critical about things. Mm-hmm. And anyway, I think most of our users are really thankful if they, there's a good product and, and a good offer shared. We as a company, we could, or as a website, we could probably do more to. Allow users to help others. Yeah. When they are new to the platform, when they've maybe not done something that another person might do without even giving it a second thought in terms of the formatting of content, the images to add. So these are all things which are, you know, it's great to hear that. There are, or some users might have a, an issue with submitting their first deal because they're afraid of the backlash. But as, as a website or, and as users, we, we can do more to highlight those, which, which need the most help. I think hopefully, you know, there might be people listening to the podcast, which is kind of the intention of doing this, that maybe have never posted a deal, you know, have commented, which is great. You know, we, we really appreciate engagement. But you know, even if you're just, just hearing what Vanessa's saying around, you know, Vanessa's experience was exactly the same. It was probably for all of us, but now Vanessa, you know, leads our German community, so that's, We started this talking about career progression. That's a great example of how you take your first step on the ladder, but it is daunting, right? You, you, anytime you put anything into the public sphere when you're not sure about the reaction, but you know, I think our, our communities, yes, they can be critical, but I think it's always done, you know, it's done with a sense of. Also helping educate people on, you know, what they want to see as well. I think there's always a misconception that our communities are just about price, and yes, that's absolutely important. But you know, we, we've talked about the, the validation that comes from people discussing, and you made a great comment, Vanessa, about why we're different than like, I. Paid reviews or you know, things that are clearly constructed just to get a product higher. Like the amount of users that post our communities that are taking a product and then I own this, these are the good things, these are the bad things. Or they post little videos and just validate, you know what it might be. I think there was a TV last this week, last week, Jason, on the site, and it got like, it got into the two thousands for the heat. And yet when you read the comments, a lot of people would just say, actually, you know, the operating system's slow and I've had this bad experience. And that for me is actually where the value is, right? Is because it. It helps you look at not just price and isolation, but that's what our community is great at. It's like critiquing a lot of the time for the right reasons to give you value in, you know, when you're reading the thread. And I think for any first time posters, you know, we wanna make sure that, you know, we are supportive and we really want them to feel like, you know, th this is a great thing to be a part of. And, you know, you do make a difference in people's lives. Yeah. We want users to jump into the comments and, and to understand is that product really worth? Them spending their money on and you, and you won't exactly like you, you say Vanessa, that you, you wouldn't get that from you know, an add-on Facebook, Instagram unless you know the comments are linked. And all the rest of it. You want experts giving you their opinion about our product. And after this podcast, I think I'm going to have to go to my deals and find your very first deal and link to, and link to. I hope it, hope it's. Something good Vanessa, and you're not allowed to, I'm gonna have to suspend your account so you can't go and delete your content. I think it's also just worth saying like how thankful we are for the work that, you know, you do as well, Vanessa and your team. You know, it's, it's a brilliant team as are all our teams and it's a lot of, a lot of that work goes unseen, not by us, hopefully, but, you know, it does get unseen sometimes by the community. But maybe just as a, a bit of levity towards the end of the podcast, are there any. Deals that you can remember that stick out in your head either for being just incredible, like, or a loophole or just unexpected. Are there any deals that spring to mind that you just thought, wow, for whatever reason? I think the, our Deal, the last one from Connect of Mars was the craziest deal ever. I didn't believe it. It's really working. Yeah. So for that reason, I, I waited, yeah, I waited and I waited for a lot of people to try if everything was working and I couldn't believe it till the end that things are really going like that. And I, I love that we have this kind of people finding holes of. Getting things cheaper that you didn't think of. Yeah. And yeah, it's, it's just crazy. I saved so much money. I don't think we actually had that posted in the uk. So just for a bit of context, do you want to Ah, yeah. It, it wasn't shared in the uk. I, I've, it might have been shared in the discussion, so it didn't have the traction anyway of Germany. Yeah. In terms of like, it, it was very visible in Germany, right? Yeah, yeah. It was huge. For, for explain the, the R deal was That you could pay in us the Argentine. Argentine dollar, I dunno. Pay peso. Is it pesos? I think so. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think so. So you could pay via PayPal and just change through Argentine pesos. And you got 40% discount on everything. Everything. It was every single thing, everything. It was crazy. So it's always like that when a deal comes up. You, you are thinking, what, what could I buy? What could I, I, yeah. And. When it, when it was over, I was really sad that I didn't buy, buy more things. But anyway, it was the best deal of of my life. The bank balance was probably not sad. Yeah. But this is why you live in a penthouse in Berlin Valley. Yeah, but I think that's such a good example of, that's the power of community, right? So our community's been going for a long time. Just when you think. They can't find the next thing, the next leap hole they do. And like that is just absolutely staggering what happens, right? And just money saving, using a loophole, sharing it with the community. Everyone making an incredible saving. Vanessa and now listener penthouse. You know who loses that? Are they? That is probably in, like if you break it down to what the deal actually was, like 40% off. Anything that you could buy through PayPal, that's probably like a once in a lifetime. Deal. And it was shared on my deals first. So the, the user posted it on as in it was his deal. It was his idea. Honestly, I think he saw the hint in another deal and then try it if it's really working. I think he, he saw the hint just for PlayStation cards. It's incredible. And then he found out that you can do it on everything where you can pay via PayPal, and he made a deal and went crazy. Mm-hmm. So again, I think if anyone's listening, if, if we could, if anyone could find us that deal again or something along those lines, maybe we'll go for 50% next time. But you know that, that that's the reason, you know, for posting your first deal, you know, just putting out into the community, seeing where it goes. And that is just a gr I mean, that's just sort of lovely story to end on, I think as well. It's just a great example of where it all comes together. So, yeah, what, what a great example. Fantastic. Thank you so much for joining us, Vanessa. Thank you for having me and excuse my bad English, it's better than mine. Yeah, and great to hear from you again, Derek. Yeah, thanks Jason. Yeah, thanks Vanessa. That was really great and we really appreciate your time today. Thank you.